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Other Topics => Off Topic Discussion => Topic started by: Andrew on November 12, 2006, 08:59:46 AM



Title: What are you learning?
Post by: Andrew on November 12, 2006, 08:59:46 AM
I tend to go through phases of learning stuff.  This has, over the years, taken me through everything from sculpting to my latest focus:  knots.  Yep, I am learning how to tie different knots.  Funny, but in many ways I wish I had known half the knots I have learned in the past two weeks.  It would have made my life easier in the past.

I can make an alpine loop, both in a standing line and around something.  Also the alpine bend, water knot, double tucked overhand loop, figure eight stopper, figure eight loop, double figure eight loop, turn and two half hitches, halyard hitch, clove hitch, square knot, taunt line hitch, bowline, ashley's stopper, dropline loop, and cobra stitch.  Not trying to learn everything, but simply good knots that meet any needs I encounter.

So, what weird thing are you learning and why?


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Susan on November 12, 2006, 04:58:51 PM
I'm the same way, I go through spells where I want to learn something. Once a read an entire book on sign language and learned it - unfortunately I had nobody to sign with.

The same went for learning German, I picked it up fairly good but had no german friends. I taught myself to juggle. Right now i'm not learning anything except how to find people on the internet - i'm learning as many tricks to perform more specific searches to locate the hard to locate. Don't ask.  I've also been getting the urge to paint but I can't bring myself to buy the paint and canvass, god knows i'd make something only a 5 year old would love.

The knot thing might come in handy. You might end up on a train that is seized by Serbian terrorists and have to think quick on containing the situation. ;-)


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: ulthar on November 12, 2006, 06:29:27 PM
Good to hear you learning knots - very useful.  I've done a fair amount of mountaineering/rapelling and sailing, and knots are important in those activies.  To your list I'd add the "bowline on a bight" and the "rolling hitch," both of which are very useful.  (The rolling hitch is a derivative of the tautline hitch that is on your list, but I THINK it is a little stronger).

When big into climbing, I used to practice tying with one hand (both strong hand and weak hand), with my eyes closed, behind my back, etc.  When my wife and I first started dating, she was amazed out how fast I could tie something like a bowline onehanded behind my back.  This came in handy while climbing.  One time, while hanging by one arm, I had to tie a knot one-handed to get out of the predicament.

As for learning new stuff, that is the story of my very existence - it both in my personal nature and the nature of the business that I run.  I do research and scientific consulting, which means I "advise" other scientists when they have problems or need a service.  I'm constantly learning new things and adapting to some new field or specialty.  I hunger for it - thirst for it.

Of course, the biggest new learning thing for me is being a parent.  That's a daily challenge.  Learning to communicate with an opinionated, indepdendent minded four year old is a constant process.  I'll probably never be good at it.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Ash on November 13, 2006, 01:59:49 AM
I went through my "dictionary phase" awhile back.
I became obsessed with learning new words. 
I would spend hours going through this mammoth Illustrated Oxford Dictionary that I own.
It has over 1000 pages of really cool pics and definitions.

(http://img224.imageshack.us/img224/1427/075136436301ss500sclzzzxv9.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)

Lately I've been on a huge Wikipedia phase.
Several nights ago after I got off work, I spent almost 4 hours on it.  I think I had somewhere around 20 seperate windows open at one time.

Yeah...I need to get a life!  LOL!   :tongueout:


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Shadow on November 13, 2006, 12:31:56 PM
Ash, I've had that same phase where I study the dictionary, just going through it page by page and looking at all the words. Now I'm in the habit of writing down any new word I see and looking it up later, then trying to use it at some point in my day. Just call me Mr. Excitment.  :teddyr:


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Ed, Ego and Superego on November 13, 2006, 01:43:59 PM
I have opportunity during the work day.  I have a long drive to and from work (about an hour) so I try and find audobooks a the library.  I try and find stuff that I wouldn't read normally.  SO I have been exposed to many new fiction books, but I also try and pick non-fiction.  I just finished a comprehensive study of Napoleon's Reign. I have also found books on the effect of Cod in Western civilization, Great Tales of English History (a series) was fun, the Great Fire of London, and the effect of Aristitle's work on the formation of the scientific method (too much ecclesiastical history)  One that found absolutely fascinating was "Higher" by Neil Bascomb.  It is about the attempts to build the tallest buildings in the 20's ad 30's. 
-Ed


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: ulthar on November 13, 2006, 03:53:57 PM
I have also found books on the effect of Cod in Western civilization

Interesting.  Are the effects of Cod more or less than the effect of Grouper?

 :teddyr:


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: RCMerchant on November 13, 2006, 08:08:22 PM
Well, I'll be going into an alchohol rehabilitation center  next Monday-I wan't to learn not to be a drunk.  :drink:


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Andrew on November 13, 2006, 08:42:10 PM
I'm the same way, I go through spells where I want to learn something. Once a read an entire book on sign language and learned it - unfortunately I had nobody to sign with.

The same went for learning German, I picked it up fairly good but had no german friends. I taught myself to juggle.

The knot thing might come in handy. You might end up on a train that is seized by Serbian terrorists and have to think quick on containing the situation. ;-)

Growing up, we had a deaf boy who lived on our street.  I was the only one who learned a good bit of sign language.  Since we were all about 11, I was probably one of the few people who could sign, "Time out, do not throw that dirt clod." in a quick and clear manner.  It is a wonder what is critical at that age.

My German is awful now.  My grandparents spoke it well, along with some of my aunts.  Unfortunately, I have not lived near them for around 15 years.  About two years ago I was able to help out some German tourists in New York.

Let's just hope that it is a train moving a shipment of rope.  Then the terrorists are really in for it.  Think "Home Alone," but with less screaming and more use of rope (suspended weights, triplines, snares).

Good to hear you learning knots - very useful.  I've done a fair amount of mountaineering/rapelling and sailing, and knots are important in those activies.  To your list I'd add the "bowline on a bight" and the "rolling hitch," both of which are very useful.  (The rolling hitch is a derivative of the tautline hitch that is on your list, but I THINK it is a little stronger).

Of course, the biggest new learning thing for me is being a parent.  That's a daily challenge.  Learning to communicate with an opinionated, indepdendent minded four year old is a constant process.  I'll probably never be good at it.

Rock climbers and SAR types are perhaps the most serious about knots that you will ever meet.  Not hard to see why.  I will check into those two knots you mention, though the bowline seems like it meets the same needs that the alpine loops answers.

I am pretty certain that, just about the time you feel you are getting the hang of parenting, they get older and change into something new.



Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Andrew on November 13, 2006, 08:43:56 PM
Well, I'll be going into an alchohol rehabilitation center  next Monday-I wan't to learn not to be a drunk.  :drink:

If this was a serious remark, my best wishes.  My father fought alcoholism and I am certain it greatly shortened his life.  His smoking did not help either. 


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Ash on November 13, 2006, 09:12:32 PM
Can you tie a hangman's noose?   :buggedout:

(http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/6587/20036251800134d61e8qq8.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)

(http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/4457/hangmansnoose34f6b74bn9.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: RCMerchant on November 13, 2006, 09:43:59 PM
b It wasn't a wisecrack. I just like to joke about it,even though it's not funny at all. I AM an alchoholic, and drinking quit being "fun" a long time ago, but a good sense of humor helps wonders.  A toast to those who CAN drink-I'll stick to blood for now on(hehehehe) :cheers: :cheers:


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: peter johnson on November 13, 2006, 10:14:35 PM
I'm still learning all the crap you've introduced here -- what the (swear word) do you think?!!?
No, the real REALOTHER THINGi'VE INTRODUCED HERE TO MYSELF IS tHEREMIN!~!
LEARNING ALL ABOUT THE THEREMIN!!
IT BEGGARS
THE IMAGINATION
i MEAN IT
IT WILL HAUNT ME UNTIL I DIE . . .
. . . not that that's a bad thing . . .
love
peter johnson



Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: peter johnson on November 13, 2006, 10:15:58 PM
Isn't that brilliant?
I managed to X through everything I'd written previously  . . .
peter




Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Susan on November 13, 2006, 10:20:17 PM
Why don't you guys learn to brew your own beer? It's not bad, my brother taught himself to do it. Makes good christmas gifts ;-) :drink:

When I was a kid I had this hand radio - it was black and it ran on a 9 volt and opened up like a book where you could see the inner workings. That was so fascinating to me that in later years I actually took apart my stereo so I could figure out how it worked. I wouldn't dare do that now with all the hokey pokey electronic stuff in there that would probably short out and ruin something expensive. i Guess i havent' been into anything lately because my job is a rubix cube which i'm constantly trying to figure out, by the time i get home my brain just wants to explode. :hot:

What i'd really love to learn is how to make a lot of money



Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: LilCerberus on November 14, 2006, 01:34:00 AM
b It wasn't a wisecrack. I just like to joke about it,even though it's not funny at all. I AM an alchoholic, and drinking quit being "fun" a long time ago, but a good sense of humor helps wonders.  A toast to those who CAN drink-I'll stick to blood for now on(hehehehe) :cheers: :cheers:

One of the things I learned during my first thirteen months & three days of sobriety, was that my drinking wasn't really the problem. Of course, the four month bender that followed this discovery taught me that it wasn't the solution, eiither. For me, drinking was just one component to a much larger problem. I quit keeping score after that, because I realized that I was simply counting days, not recovering.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Dr. Whom on November 14, 2006, 03:34:26 AM


Let's just hope that it is a train moving a shipment of rope.  Then the terrorists are really in for it.  Think "Home Alone," but with less screaming and more use of rope (suspended weights, triplines, snares).



You could turn this into a movie, you know.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: RCMerchant on November 14, 2006, 07:17:53 AM
lilcerberus-Thats why I have to go to rehab-to try and figure out what my problem is.I don't have a problem drinking-hell, I'm GOOD at that,I have a problem when I'm NOT drinking.I just havn't figgered out what it is yet.
I did learn how to upload my own avatar,though.Hey,Peter-is your computer dirty inside.One of my wifey's freinds blew all the dust and crap out of ours, and it worked MUCH better.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Derf on November 14, 2006, 01:34:08 PM
I've been teaching myself a few things lately. I've been making/selling jewelry (mostly earrings) for almost a year, and at this point I've only spent about twice as much money on supplies as I've made selling stuff. Is that a good business model or what?

I've also been taking massage therapy classes (anybody want to get nearly naked and have a fat, hairy old man rub 'em down with oil? :buggedout:) in order to give myself a portable career and finally move someplace that doesn't feel like the deepest pit of hell all summer (Mid-November - still 80 degrees Farenheit outside, and that's actually cooler than yesterday).


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Ed, Ego and Superego on November 14, 2006, 02:08:24 PM
As for brewing my own beer, its something I find interesting (Same with mead and home hard cider).  But one of the foundations of my marriage is that I don't do anything hobbyish that is a) foul smelling b) would explode or c) involve home sausage making. 
In the interest of pace in the home I decided to abide by this.   My one attempt at home coffee roasting was embarassing enough.  If you try this, DO IT OUTSIDE.
-Ed


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Shadow on November 14, 2006, 06:00:21 PM
I bought a big book and started teaching myself HTML. So far, so good.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: LilCerberus on November 15, 2006, 02:36:45 AM
I have ADHD & Asperger's, so I never really *learn* anything, I just sorta pick up on it sooner or later. One of the things that I haven't picked up on yet, is that I'm one of those kindsa' folks who never learn.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: dean on November 15, 2006, 04:30:33 AM

I've been trying to re-teach myself how to write music.  I used to play piano back in the day, but that was in my early teens, so I've been revisiting styles lately.  Over the last two or so years I've been on and off attempting to learn how to use a music program known as Fruityloops and have only recently started to get the vague hang of it.  Sure, the sounds are more like 8 bit video game soundtracks, but it's fun to play around with if you sample the right thing!

Here are a couple of examples that I just recently uploaded.

The first uses some quotes from here actually, plus some I've gathered from elsewhere: It's called "The Tingler" and was my attempt at a bit of a B-movie/Vincent Price tribute.  It's almost a a year and a half old though.  I'm sure you'll figure out some of the lines [since it's not hard to guess.]  As another fun fact, part of the backing track is from a Hammer Horror soundtrack [I think, it's been a while so I can't remember which one]  I think it's from one of the ones with Frankenstien, Dracula and the Wolfman all in one [House of Frankenstien?] But I could be wrong...


http://www.myfilehut.com/userfiles/166076/The%20Tingler.mp3 (http://www.myfilehut.com/userfiles/166076/The%20Tingler.mp3)

I suppose the other that's sort of on topic is a remix attempt I made for some of Jeff Wayne's musical version of "War of the Worlds"

http://www.myfilehut.com/userfiles/166076/waroftheworlds.mp3 (http://www.myfilehut.com/userfiles/166076/waroftheworlds.mp3)

Please bear in mind that these were made for fun and I am in no way meaning to be ripping off or trying to breach Copyright!  Just fun I say!

But that's what I've been learning lately I suppose!


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: RCMerchant on November 15, 2006, 07:26:03 AM
I don't like to seem like a nitpicker,but Hammer didn't make those old monster rally movies (ie.HOUSE of FRANKENSTIEN,HOUSE of DRACULA) ,Universal did.I'm kinda an old classic B/W horror-scifi movie geek.Sorry. I'll go away now....(mumble...mumble...young kids nowadays....)


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: RCMerchant on November 15, 2006, 07:38:45 AM
Wow. Thats pretty cool! You should make a video for it.I caught old Criswell in there too.Groovy!


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: ulthar on November 16, 2006, 12:04:21 AM
One of the things I'm trying to learn right now is RSA encryption.  I need to write some code dealing with credit card numbers and want to actually understanding the technique before trusting it.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: LilCerberus on November 16, 2006, 02:05:04 AM
Tonight, I learned the basic principal behind the jet engine, the sound barrier, & why the movie Pueblo Sin Suerte has a character named Cotton Mathers.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: dean on November 16, 2006, 03:09:20 AM
I don't like to seem like a nitpicker,but Hammer didn't make those old monster rally movies (ie.HOUSE of FRANKENSTIEN,HOUSE of DRACULA) ,Universal did.I'm kinda an old classic B/W horror-scifi movie geek.Sorry. I'll go away now....(mumble...mumble...young kids nowadays....)

Oh I get them mixed up all the time.  All I know is that I had a "Best Of Hammer Horror" Soundtrack CD, House Of Frankenstien [I think] and another I keep forgetting the name of [can't find it right now to check, I have too much crap lying around] and some of the backing was from one of them, though I can't remember which one...

 :question: :buggedout:


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Amanda on November 19, 2006, 05:18:50 PM
Everyone else is learning cool things, I am just learning *necessary* things.  I'm in college (28 year old freshman!  Go me!) and am taking Microbiology this semester.  Lecture is a little tiny bit dull, but lab is terribly fun!  I' m learning to grow colonies of organisms! 


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: zombiedudeman on November 19, 2006, 05:40:36 PM
I'm trying to learn nunchucks, ever since seeing Deadbeat at Dawn they've intrigued me, it's also a good workout. I'm trying to also learn how to make songs using nothing but guitar taps (simliar to bands like Hella and Don Caballero), it's pretty hard.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Andrew on November 19, 2006, 05:55:44 PM
I'm trying to learn nunchucks

I think the learning curve is what would dissuade me from learning to use them. 


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: RCMerchant on November 19, 2006, 07:25:00 PM
Well tomorrow I go to rehab! I won't be hearing from you guys inna while,I guess.I have to learn how to view the world without rose colored eyeballs.Happy trails! :thumbup:


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: LilCerberus on November 19, 2006, 11:13:42 PM
Well tomorrow I go to rehab! I won't be hearing from you guys inna while,I guess.I have to learn how to view the world without rose colored eyeballs.Happy trails! :thumbup:

There are, of course, ways to compensate.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Shadow on November 19, 2006, 11:16:43 PM
I am currently learning to hate this worthless POS RobertT, who has spammed the entire board and every inbox with his crap. :hatred:


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: ulthar on November 20, 2006, 12:00:46 AM
Well tomorrow I go to rehab! I won't be hearing from you guys inna while,I guess.I have to learn how to view the world without rose colored eyeballs.Happy trails! :thumbup:

Hey, RC, good luck.  We'll all be thinkin' about you and sending you that positive energy.  Of course, your first act upon successful completion must be, MUST BE, a sober viewing of PLAN 9.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: dean on November 20, 2006, 02:25:16 AM
Well tomorrow I go to rehab! I won't be hearing from you guys inna while,I guess.I have to learn how to view the world without rose colored eyeballs.Happy trails! :thumbup:

Hey, RC, good luck.  We'll all be thinkin' about you and sending you that positive energy.  Of course, your first act upon successful completion must be, MUST BE, a sober viewing of PLAN 9.

Is that possible?  Don't need to temp the guy right away.  That's like throwing someone who's trying to quit into the middle of a cigar bar isn't it?

Good luck mate!


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Yaddo 42 on November 23, 2006, 06:02:15 AM
Good luck and stay strong RCMerchant. 

Not actively learning anything formal these days, but since I'm planning to try to go back to school next year I'm trying to get back in the mindset of focusing on more serious reading. Right now I'm in the middle of a book about Islam and the tenets and practices of being a Muslim. Wanted to gain some insight into the everyday life of a practicing Muslim, even though I'm an atheist. Last week I met a Muslim girl through a friend and we talked as I asked her questions, she answered what she could, made me wish I was further in the book.

I'm considering trying to learn another language, but can't decide which one to try, my Spanish is so-so and need practice, but I know I could pick up another Romance/Latin-based language with not too much extra effort. Maybe something outside that part of the world.

I guess I should try to learn to add an avatar, just for the practice, but unless I find one of Ignatz Mouse from Krazy Kat, I probably wouldn't stick with one long.

Oh, I am learning that whenever I add a new stomach exercise to my exercise routine, that the more I swear when I finish it, the more effective it probably is. The more I swear while I'm doing it, the more likely it is that I'm hurting myself and doing it wrong.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: djweevil on November 24, 2006, 04:35:56 AM
I am learning now that i am a hermit. I have constructed a wall of movies around myself no joke. It is my saftey blanket and also that my childhood is never going to come back i watched revenge of the nerds the other day and wanted to see what they looked like how and how their careers went and was saddened they are old now with grey hair and stuff all my heroes are dying R.I.P Charles Bronson, Dolph Lundgren is tiny and old now he wears sweaters in all his movies now . My hockey heroes are old and getting ready to retire now, I am having a pre mid life crisis i think. And if anyone has a time machine i could borrow drop me a line ;) Oh Yeah i started making puppets so i am learning to carve wood sort of and how crazy glue works good like stiches.   


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: peter johnson on November 26, 2006, 12:34:44 AM
Hmm . . .
This would explain why I never got any artwork from RC for the show -- now done -- back in October --
Oh, well -- best of best & all that --
peter j.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Dennis on November 26, 2006, 10:01:44 PM
My wife and I are attempting to learn astronomy, looked into a class at the local community college and found out they assign homework, the instructor was not amused when I said people over the age of 50 don't do homework, it's a state regulation. 


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: ulthar on November 27, 2006, 01:43:32 AM
My wife and I are attempting to learn astronomy, looked into a class at the local community college and found out they assign homework, the instructor was not amused when I said people over the age of 50 don't do homework, it's a state regulation. 

So, take the class and don't do the homework.  If you are taking it for learning, and you don't really care about the grade, well, who cares if the guy fails you?  That doesn't mean you didn't learn anything.  (Of course, it might hurt your chances of taking more interesting classes at that school).

Did you ask the guy about an audit, or taking it for non-credit?  Some schools allow this - where you pay your money (the school likes this part), but don't get credit for it (no homework/tests for you, no additional grading for the teacher)

Other alternatives: join a local astronomy club, or at least visit with them at a meeting or two; dig through astronomy related web sites; buy a telescope and a good astronomy book (textbook or otherwise) and have at it.

(Sorry; I'm up late writing a test for one of my classes tomorrow, and I'm in an encouraging, "You can Do It" frame of mind).


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Ash on November 27, 2006, 02:18:32 AM
Ulthar's advice was good. 
I have a friend who's in a local astronomy club and he loves it.
I used to have a love of astronomy when I was in my late teens and early 20's but I eventually outgrew it and moved on to other interests.
I still find some of it interesting though.
Black holes are quite fascinating and I love to look at images captured by the Hubble Telescope.

Another thing I'd recommend is Wikipedia.
You can learn most everything from Wikipedia that you could in a classroom. 
And it's free!
Granted, you won't have the in-class dicussions and general hands-on learning that comes with the classroom setting but you'll definitely learn a lot.

Wikipedia is an extremely powerful learning tool.

I recommend that you begin here:
CATEGORY: ASTRONOMY (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Astronomy)

There are many subfields, subcategories, and hundreds of pages on this topic.  There are also many media pages with incredible pictures for you to view.
It goes on and on.
If you're one of those types who don't mind learning from a computer, then Wikipedia is for you.
If you prefer the classroom setting, Wikipedia can greatly augment your learning experience.
Either way, you can't go wrong with either of them.

Enjoy!   :smile:


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Andrew on November 27, 2006, 12:06:43 PM
My wife and I are attempting to learn astronomy, looked into a class at the local community college and found out they assign homework, the instructor was not amused when I said people over the age of 50 don't do homework, it's a state regulation. 

The homework could be interesting.  Everything from doing a little backyard binocular stargazing, to looking through a deep sky atlas and locating certain objects.

Many local astronomy groups have stargazing nights.  The members bring their telescopes to a certain place, set them all up, and everyone spends the evening looking at different objects and socializing.  Most of the time, they are happy to meet people interested in the hobby and will happily provide you with a crash course.  You might want to check with any local observatory or astronomy department to get in touch with that group.

While I was based in Twenty-nine Palms I would spend hours hiking (I did not have a car there) into Joshua Tree Park to the spot where the group of stargazers would meet.  It was always well worth it.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Dennis on November 28, 2006, 12:00:02 AM
My wife and I are attempting to learn astronomy, looked into a class at the local community college and found out they assign homework, the instructor was not amused when I said people over the age of 50 don't do homework, it's a state regulation. 
With all the great advice that you guys gave me I should explain this post. I spent a lot of time reading the topic, when I got to the end and decided to add one myself I got the first part in then had to leave, so in an attempt at humor I  finished quickly with the part about the instructor. He really was not amused by my response to his answer about homework, I had to tell him I was joking.


Title: Re: What are you learning?
Post by: Dennis on November 29, 2006, 10:19:45 PM
My wife and I are attempting to learn astronomy, looked into a class at the local community college and found out they assign homework, the instructor was not amused when I said people over the age of 50 don't do homework, it's a state regulation. 
With all the great advice that you guys gave me I should explain this post. I spent a lot of time reading the topic, when I got to the end and decided to add one myself I got the first part in then had to leave, so in an attempt at humor I  finished quickly with the part about the instructor. He really was not amused by my response to his answer about homework, I had to tell him I was joking.

 Our interest in astronomy is due mainly to my wife,  she got me interested in it and it just grew from there. The biggest problem with the class was finding the time to attend, not the homework, we would not consider paying fees and then not doing the work, that just isn't right. The one local  club I checked on made me feel that they weren't interested in us, not that we were unwanted but more that we, as beginners were unworthy, probably I caught the guy on a bad day. We got started ourselves buying a 60 millimeter refractor from HSN of all places, it came with a pair of 8x40 binoculars, got a book on star watching for beginners and started to teach ourselves. Over the last year we have aquired another 60 millimeter refractor, a 4" reflector and a pair of 15x75 binoculars. got a tripod for these as they weigh a ton, we spend anywhere from 4 to 6 hours a night, 1 to 2 nights a month observing, weather permitting. We do this in our driveway or front yard as these are the only areas that have enough room. The books we have come with great star maps and so we are slowly learning what we are doing.
 One thing that never fails is to give a youngster,teenager, or any one who has never looked at the sky a pair of binoculars and have them look at the moon. The reaction is usually something like "ooh I can see craters" or "can I see where the astronauts landed".
  One thing I have learned is that this is an expensive hobby and I don't think we'll be buying any more scopes in the near future.