Badmovies.org Forum

The Internet is place where people of all ages, races, religions or none, size, and everything else in between can all to come together and speak freely.  However, the Internet is also the breeding ground for insane amounts of hate towards various things.  Trends, fashions, shows, movies, games, people, religion, politics, fetishes, cars, ideas, comics, and just about whatever else you can imagine.  In this sea of hatred, I have come to realize that tons of the hate I just don't get.

I understand the Twilight Final Fantasy furry, Paris Hilton, George Lucas, and much more hate because everyone is civil enough to explain it and give a good reason & understanding.  However, there are things I don't understand.  Why do people hate Miley Cyrus, Justin Beiber, Jaden Smith, and others?!  Could someone spell it out for me?

So, in other words, do you have any idea why people hate Miley Cyrus, Justin Bebier, and Jaden Smith so much?  I'm just trying to understand this hate that doesn't seem to make sense.  No one ever really says why they hate them, they just wish the worst on these people and don't explain why! 

I hate JB because his fan boys/girls kept bad mouthing other types of music which sparked a war of music.

This phenomenon has been going on since before the internet; the net has simply given these people a place to come together and become even more vocal about their hatred (often inadvertently giving them the illusion that since potentially thousands of people on X website/forum hate it, then EVERYONE must hate it).

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PeripheryHatedom?from=Main.TheBarney (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PeripheryHatedom?from=Main.TheBarney)

Myself, I don't really have the time or energy to really hate something from pop culture. It just seems like too much work for something that ultimately isn't satisfying (after all, someone somewhere will like the thing you hate). It just seems so much more productive and healthier to just say "Well, I don't care for it, but you can like it if you want. Just don't expect me to do the same."

While criticizing something that wasn't meant for you is perfectly valid (provided that you're criticizing it on its own terms; you'd look like an idiot and a snob if you expected, say, "Spongebob" to meet the same standards as "Citizen Kane", after all) hating something apparently for the sole reason that it wasn't made for you is just plain ridiculous.

Ah!  But shouldn't the fans be hated more than singer since he isn't the one badmouthing other music?  It sort of like hating the Xbox because X-Box fanboys that mock any fan of the Wii or PS3.  Well that's just my thought at least.  Thanks for explain some of the reason for why he is hated though.

I hate the fact that Lady Gaga is popular and it has nothing to do with envy.
Gaga to me is like the bad Quentin Tarantino of music. Tarantino pays homage to the good stuff and things of influence, and uses it in his movies in the most coolest way possible.
Gaga rips off anything and uses it to her own sorry advantage. She is a walking style-charade constantly channeling vintage icons without an ounce of originality. Same goes for her videos or music. If anything, she is just a poor white trash recycling queen, a bad 80s Italo flick without dubbing, wrapped in lame provocateur-isms.
She feeds people with utter fakeness and people are buying it. I just don't get it.

basically, I don't give a crap abut him, but his vids are the only way to get back at the fans. If you see a JB vid that saids 1 out 40 it is because I flagged the mecha vid because I was really angry at his fans.

Miley Cyrus, Justin Bebier, and Jaden Smith all have very young fan bases and older kids and teens want to prove they're cool and mature by hating on them.

I think it's just part of the internet culture, and a rather amusing part at that.  I don't believe people actually "hate" these people any more than they're truly in awe of Chuck Norris.  Part of the fun is that people who are really fans of these celebrities, movies, etc. get genuinely upset about the "hate", and that makes everyone else laugh.

However, this hatred gets way out of hand though when they actually start saying they want these people killed and or raped and then get people who actually agree with that statement.  Those people are what prompted me to start this topic because I cannot understand the deep and dark hatred they have.

I think that in part that's the age factor again.  I think that the people making those claims don't really understand the bigness of words like 'rape' and 'kill'; the depth of meaning is defined by TV, movies and video games (in other words, unreal settings where there is no real consequence visible), with no 'real life' experience with any of it to really understand them.

I chalk it up to immaturity; that does not make it any more palatable.

I also attribute part of it to the general degradation of the language itself.  All over TV, especially reality tv, terms like "doomed," "dead," "fight for your life," etc uses these "big words" in everyday situations where they don't really apply.  That dilutes the meaning.

I don't know; maybe the hatred really IS that deep.  On the other hand, maybe it's just a bunch of winy, selfish, narcissistic, spoiled brats trying to be 'dramatic' and 'cool.'

I just wanted to say I love lady gaga    :tongueout:

I doubt it's actual hatred (for most of these people, anyway). This is the same general group that dragged the term "epic" down from meaning "possessing qualities of epicness" to "something vaguely positive that I like." For them, "hate" means "dislike."

It's the same as it ever was, only now people can put stuff out for everybody to read instead of just sharing it with their friends (and enemies.)  I remember back when New Kids on the Block was hugely popular, I felt pretty much the same way back then as a bunch of people do now towards the current teen pop stars.

As for the "I WANT THESE PEOPLE DEAD!" crowd, I put them blame there not on absolute hatred, but the difficulty in conveying emotion over the internet.  I'm sure you've said things like "I'm going hurt you now," or "You are soooo dead!" or things to that effect to your friends, not because you're going to hurt them or even because you want to, but simply because it's fun to say and gets the point across. 

As far as Jaden Smith is concerned, don't know much about him. However I consider Justin Bieber and Miley Cyrus as crap. I feel they are fabricated auto-tuned mediocre singers whom only have any fan base because they were marketed to 10-15 year old girls.
Miley is from a long history of Disney fabricated low talent stars which have become media darlings going back to Annette Funichelio (or however it's spelled). She might have some hope if she tries to go into country music in a few years but I feel she has no long tern staying power in pop music. However even in the country music genre, she most likely will meet with the same hit success which her father met which was mostly a one hit wonder who has been doing what he can to extend his 15 minutes of fame by lately riding his daughter's coat tails.
Justin Bieber was a youtube fad which Lady Gaga happen to help get signed to a recording label. i have heard his music and it has nothing that you wouldn't find in any flash in the pan one teen heart throb act.  Those tend to fade away in a couple of years. Expect him to be in the where are they now category in 10 years or off Broadway at best.
As far as the fans for both these people, they tend to mostly be young girls who have no knowledge of music beyond their fandom. Most will grow out of it and have a few fond memories of them. Those who don't usual end up as programming executives for SyFy and cancel shows which have an audience to bring you another ghost hunting show.

That was to be expected  :tongueout:

Funny thing is, I never truly hated anything with such a deep passion in my life before. Along comes Gaga and 'click' I'm like a sleeper suddenly awaken.
There was a time I wanted to smack people upside the head for listening to her music or even mentioning her name, but I'm way over that (I think. I'll have to consult with my Psychiatrist first)   :wink:

 :bouncegiggle:

I rest my case. Even more reason to hate her  :bouncegiggle:

lol...

Not really true.

They either like them. Love them. Feel so-so about them. Or hate them.

The merit for hate itself can veries from person to person and at times it could be the complete opposite for the reason why people love them.

The hate can also could be based upon the person's point of view.

For example (and true about me):

My hatred towards the new Star Wars Trilogy is based upon the 20 year wait and the stories seemed to be put together very quickly, without the thought of the original series and without the respect that people has actually seen the original series at least more then once; I also think George Lucas can do better then that and during the 20 hiatus there has been comicbooks, books and video games that has a better (and respectful) vision towards the franchise then the prequel trilogy.

I'm not much of a Star Wars fanboy... I just dont like incompetence when there is no reason for incompetence. I just think its pure lazyness on the film maker's end. My feelings are equal with Godfather 3, as well as any dozens of remakes...

and


I'm curious...

Why do you CARE what other people like, listen to or buy?

I've never liked {$INSERT_NAME_OF_POP_ICON} and express my opinion with my dollars - specifically those I DON'T spend.  Beyond that, why is it worth the emotional energy?

All of this seems like an outgrowth of a "be like me" culture.  We pay lip service to "diversity" and "open mindedness," but at the end of the day, we FIND stuff to 'hate' others for.  It used to be race or culture in general; now, it seems to be football teams, colleges, singers/entertainers, etc.

I think just about every movie board on IMDB has a thread "I hate this movie" (or some such) with at least one reply "then why are you posting here?"

It is a VERY interesting phenomenon to me - in a people watcher sort of way.

I am a self confessed "player hater" which is something I think you are born with.  I grew up reading MAD Magazine that virtually trashed anything "cool" and even back when, I totally related to that.  Whenever I see someone like Justin Bieber making more money than me I hate on him.  My frame of mind pretty much resorts to wondering why people would invest time and money to a whiny kid with a bad haircut.  Of course my existence in this realm backfires a lot.  I've often wondered in the past why people don't like the stuff I do.  Then when it becomes popular, I end up hating on the people and product.  Logical?  Nope, its just the way I am.  The Chapelle skit made me realize it actually.  
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Dzxef1muoQ
On a different page I've always said that it doesn't take "talent" to make good music. Hence a good amount of stuff I enjoy.  I guess whatever is cool is what I say is cool and vice versa.  No one is allowed to disagree.   :tongueout: :teddyr: :bouncegiggle:

I think the word "hate" is tossed about too freely - as the word "love" is too.

"Hate" is used in place of "resent" "am very annoyed by" "am disgusted by" "dislike to an extreme" "can't stand" - and so on.  To say one "hates" or "loves" implies an emotional content to the reaction that in fact may not be there.

Lady Gaga and Justin Bieber are annoying because we are over-exposed to their work (which, granted, one may find annoying enough in itself!) and because we are endlessly subjected to the extreme and loud adulation of their fans.  Enough, already!

I don't hate any of these people brought up, Jaden, Justin, Miley, Gaga. What I hate with a passion is the vapid culture that these individuals represent, call me a curmudgeon, I don't mind. But I don't hate these people. The getting out of hand that you're talking about is, I think, just an equally vapid reaction by people who lack a more mature way of expressing what they have a problem with.

Honestly, I would have no idea who Lady Gaga or Justin Bieber were if not for this board.  Other than the posters who are still in high school (or have kids in high school), I honestly don't know where you guys hear about them.  They're just not on my radar screen.

Agree.. :)

Nah, when I say I "hate" something it usually fits that definition. 

I don't hate these people.  I just think they are pretentious little twerps, so I just ignore them.  As they get older, my opinion may change.  I thought Leonardo DiCaprio was a pretentious twerp up to, and including, his appearance in TITANIC.  However, since then, I have grown to respect him as an actor and I often look forward to his movies now.

*Sigh* oh to move in such a rarified atmosphere...or, on second thought: maybe not.   :wink:


Duly noted: The DS takes his Dr Seuss seriously.

C'mon Newt, the air's fine up here!  I've imported a fine selection of Ed Wood and Uwe Boll movies into my ivory tower.  But Lady Gaga and Miley Cyrus look like insignificant little specks from here. 

 :teddyr:  Don't tempt me - !  Sounds idyllic.

Ditto. If it weren't for random anecdotes from friends/co-workers/people I talk to on the internet, I'd have no idea who these people were, either. I don't listen to the radio (except, perhaps, for the weather forecast or to check out what's playing on the campus station) and I rarely watch TV, so I've never heard any of their songs. They're not forced on you if you don't partake in mass media (and even then you can change the channel or the station).

The problem with those two is that they TOOK over Youtube.


okay, not really, but VEVO has that stupid pic of Bieber. IT'S REALLY ANNOYING when your watching a vid and there's ANOTHER person/band staring at you, it's like your being watched when your not. Lady Gaga has just boomed the "techno pop" to new heights, which is good, but now every new FRIGGEN band has to be f**king techno pop?! Seriously, it's just doesn't make sense anymore, creativity, out of the window!  :hatred: :bluesad:

She's not so bad, honestly.  I think she tries too hard to get attention at times (the meat dress at the VMA's, admitting to cocaine use but declaring people shouldn't do it or whatever), but ultimately I don't feel her music is too terribly bad for what it is.  There's certainly far more less talented musicians/singers out there.  Gaga's music is good for a night out when you're drinking, partying, drugging it up and want the upbeat music and empty lyrics.  Beyond that, I wouldn't say she's a great talent.

The 'Net is a safety net of sorts for people to say things they wouldn't normally say to others face to face (for whatever reason) and the fact they are safe in their own homes, (and with some distance from their opponents) gives them that feeling of superiority. Armchair bravado, so to speak. But, how much of it is only smoke, vs. the ones who REALLY feel that way, will always be unknown, and that is what makes these individuals more dangerous, as some have taken their speech to the next level (in some cases.)



While not directly related to the issue, a good recent example of this (w\regard to the quote above) is how the media handled the murder of abortion doctor Dr. George Tiller.   

O' Reilly is blamed for the same thing I quoted above. But at some point, the individual is responsible, and not the words. Because you hear it dosen't mean you have to act on it.

And there are people out there who are just plain nuts, regardless of hate speech. But trying to separate the two (pre-meditative murder vs. aggravated murder) is always a gray area marred by politics and the media, and often for their own purposes.

I wouldn't say I dislike Justin Bieber, but that I dislike his music.  I think any perceived "hatred" I may have with him might have been brought on by the scores of people who have questioned me on saying I'm not into his music.  Specifically, it's those who say that there's no way I can't like his music, but I honestly don't.  His voice annoys me, and the instrumental and/or studio aspects of his music do nothing for me.  Some have said he has a perfect voice and I beg to differ.  Perfection in such a case is, after all, subjective. 

I think a lot of the hate we see on the internet is also an outlet for some people.  It's a way to blow off steam, and people like Angry Video Game Nerd, filmnstuff, and Cinema Snob have been able to channel some of that hatred for easily despicable things into something comical. 

The thing with them is that they know they're nitpicking and they use characters that are almost unpleasable (well, the Nerd and Cinema Snob, anyway; I don't watch filmnstuff, so I wouldn't know about them). Heck, Brad has admitted that he enjoys a number of the movies that the Snob hates and is more or less parodying the strange practise of high-brow film critics bashing exploitation films for not meeting the same standards as art and Oscar-worthy movies.

I had a guy at Youtube get all upset with me and call me "fuc**ng  fa**ot"
because I said that Udo Dirkschneider of Accept was a very unlikely candidate for a metal singer, because he didn't look the part (one look at the man confirms this.)

And then I got the usual accusations- I was an "Emo fa**ot" and a "pu**y pop music lover" and all that.  All because I alluded to Udo's unconventional appearance and how it became his stage gimmick. 

It's like the ultimate kneejerk reaction..people react to the repies befroe they read them. Maybe more than a reaction, it's how they programmed themselves..I dunno.

I stand by my idea that, like Godwin's, the moment you imply that the other person is a homosexual in a discussion, you lose since it's obvious that you don't have an argument. The only exceptions come from situations where at least one participant actually is a homosexual, but even then those exceptions are few.

Sigh, I know this feeling. I like Green day and I get called a that as well. oh well, life never wins. :lookingup:

Well, in my eyes, Green Day is a somewhat antagonistic group. Songs like American Idiot Know Your Enemy and Last Of The American Girls are somewhat antagonistic and condescending to true hard working conservatives who haven't been spoiled by partisanship or extremism.  Apparently they haven't looked around them at real people with unspoiled values. They need to get out more. 

That dosen't mean that you're bad for listening to them, or that everyone who does buys their message.   And it dosen't mean you're bad if you buy their political schtick. You're entitled.

I went thru this in the 80's with heavy metal. It was hard for people to believe that a long haired, cycle jacketed headbanger was actually somewhat conservative in his thinking. And I got called a "poser" and all that stuff you go thru too.

Life never won for me either, bud   :bluesad:

Filmnstuff is one guy, like AVGN, and he's probably nastier with the swearing and blatant hatred.  He's actually gotten into video flame wars with other Youtube users, particularly over his Robocop 2 review.  I will say he did go a tad over the line saying that anyone who liked Robocop 2 on NES was a masochist, and that Ocean is "paying them." 

I still stand on the venting half of it.  It's mainly when people become downright insulting that I think vehement hatred towards something gets out of hand.  I've always hated when people imply that my liking something is obviously a sign that the company is paying me.  Case in point:

http://www.gamefaqs.com/ps/198909-tenchu-2-birth-of-the-stealth-assassins/reviews/review-23052

The parts where he bashes the game are fine by me.  The parts where he bashes those who enjoy the game are out of line. 

 

I don't know about Robocop 2 players, but anyone who went thru NES's version of Ninja Gaiden must have been real masochists..(any more at this point would self incriminate me) :twirl:



I had a friend like that....and it was funny when he would turn around after criticizing people who like a certain game, and then curse his head off when HE couldn't get thru it, lol  Crazy stuff...

The Youtube comment section is the armpit of the internet. 
Sure there are worse places, but you can't expect to find anything there that doesn't stink. 
Seriously, just trying to read some of that stuff makes you a more stupiderest person. 

What's funny are the number of people who think it is serious - particularly the AVGN, who is quite obviously a persona/character.  James Rolfe, the creator/writer/actor/everything guy behind it, has talked about this before.  He's also one of the nicest guys around, which is kind of funny when he gets interviewed and people aren't expecting it.  I suspect the character appeals for a couple reasons - for younger people, he comes across as somewhat of a spoof of the modern internet "hater".  For people a little older, who were gamers way back when, the character is often an exaggeration of how angry we ourselves got with such games (his TMNT NES review, which was what made him big, is the case in point).  His nostalgia-ridden monologues reference this. 

But yeah, internet hate is often a crazy thing.  So many things get so blown out of proportion, that it becomes impossible to take seriously.  I'm glad there aren't too many things that get me genuinely that angry. 

On that note, I dunno if I really can say I like her as I only know like three of her songs, but Lady Gaga is OK in my books.  Well, in the sense that I enjoy those three songs anyway.  Basically, I think the melodies are good and I never care if the lyrics of a song are meaningless.  Deep criticism of music is something that doesn't matter to me - I either like a song or not, that's about it.  Sometimes this results in my liking songs that are rather embarrassing to like.  Oh well.

I never wondered whether the guy was serious or not.  I've always disliked the guy because I don't think he's nearly as funny as he thinks he is. 

It sucks, really.  I like punk, and I also like Green Day.  I'm not necessarily saying that I think they're 'punk', but that community banished them years and years ago and if you even speak their name in that company, you're damn near banished and told you're a sellout for liking them. 

And these are people that shop at Hot Topic.  Not for nothing, but I'd say if you're a punk or rebel, the last place I'd shop is a corporate America pansy store that targets 14 year old girls.  Can someone explain this to me? :question:

Well, for me Youtube is cool because I find a lot of retro-horror movies, old commercials, or old music videos from MTV's Headbanger's Ball days As well as a lot of other stuff from my youth in the 80's.

These idiots that pull this stuff we're talking about actually make me laugh, it's to the point where it's nothing to me (to say little of the value I placed on it to begin with.)

That said, not all topics go south..sometimes you get people who agree with you on any given subject, and it winds up leading to some good and civil discussions.  Take the good with the bad.

I liken the Green Day-Punk Rock issue to the initial (and sometimes still going) separation in the Metallica camps after they came out withe their "Nu-Metal" sound.  The battle still rages on at Youtube and other sites across Cyberspace..

As to the flip-flops who shop at Hot Topic, who knows? It seems that while most people are true to their beliefs (and don't sway from them) it seems that we as a species, have the need to get the best of both worlds. 

And at 14,  you want to be "cool" and "in the club" and all that, so I think it's more a matter of social survival than anything else. If you want to be a bling-laden pop diva, you shop at TJ Maxx.  You wanna be cool, you go to Hot Topic. HT has cooler stuff, anyway.  :smile:

I've said before and I'll say it again the whole "selling out" thing makes no sense to me.   Its about money in the world and to deny that is just silly.  Who wants to play the local club for some bucks while you could be selling out arenas for millions?  If they choose the "some bucks" option they'll more than likely end up looking like an 40 year old idiot sporting a wallet chain and mohawk.  But hey, at least they can claim to be "anti-establishment".  :lookingup:

As for the Hot Topic, its a wonderful mask for corporate American and once again "anti-establishment".  Just make sure you pick up your Ozzy slippers and black metal t-shirt for 50 bucks.  All major credit card accepted!   :thumbup:  Who cares if 200,00 kids nationwide look just like YOU do!  You're a rebel baby!

I suspect it's part of the process of growing up and figuring out who you are. Most of us have gone through phases that, looking back, were pretty silly. In trying them out, we experimented and realized that no, that's not who we were. It's also been accepted in psychology that during the teenage years it's normal for a teen to test and push the boundaries that were set for them since childhood. It's just part of growing up and establishing yourself as an independent person. Thankfully, most people grow out of the phase of taking music so seriously that they will dislike a person upon hearing that they don't listen to the same genre/bands as they do.

The big issue is people apply the term "selling out" in ways that don't really apply.  Making a lot of money playing and recording the music you always wanted to isn't selling out.  It's when they deliberately water down and alter their music purely to sell more albums that they've "sold out".  Sometimes people also use the term "sold out" to equal "became popular", which I just find strange.

I don't actually shot at Hot Topic, but they have cool T-shirts and that's about the extent of my like for them. As for saying they have cooler stuff, I meant more in terms of it's unconventional nature.

Posted by: The Gravekeeper


Well said!  :teddyr:   Finding out who you are thru a series of things, attitudes and styles that please you (while they offend others) is part of the game.  We've all been thru it.

You go around, and you come around, with a lot of experimentation in between.

You either stay a certain way, or you find a way to fit into the daily world while you keep your core beliefs\attitudes to yourself in a place where noone but you can access them. 

Or, in the other corner, you go 360 degrees opposite of your beliefs and become something you never thought you'd become ( I.E. Liberal to Conservative or vice versa.)

It's quite a process.

I've shopped at Hot Topic in the past and places like Spencer Gifts.  However, I think there is just a really fine line between shopping there and believing you are making a monumental statement with their goods.

I guess it boils down to, for this thread anyhow, do what you dig.  As long as its in the law and not hurting anyone. 

I just buy shirts, as in Misfits, and got a "Hello, My Name is Iningo Montoya, You killed My Father, Prepare to Die"

I don't completely hate Hot Topic itself as a store.  I hate the people who think it's fashionable to shop there in order to 'rebel' when they're really just doing what everyone else is doing.  They're not selling out, they're "buying in' to corporate America.  Nothing wrong with it.

I've seen some Misfits stuff there, t-shirts and all, and yeah, bought them.  Just cause it was convenient.  But I've since found it's easier to buy it directly from their website or find same items at Thrift Stores or other specialty shops that isn't a corporation.  Doesn't make me better than anyone.  Ultimately if I buy something from Hot Topic, it's not a matter of me feeling like I fit in, I just hate that others do it just cause it's cool to try and fit in rather than making any kind of real political or punk type of statement of their own.

Sounds like Hot Topic is the TapOut version of those that watch UFC and fancy themselves martial arts masters, even though they've never been in a fight or done any training whatsoever.

I try to avoid Hot Topic if I can, what with the Atomsphere (a mom 'n pop store in the mall that sells merchandise of rock, metal, and punk bands). 

I realize AVGN is a character, but I still think the observation I made is viable.  He bases his character on haters, and is therefore channeling the hatred to make something that's intended to be funny.  I say intended to be because I find that he's getting less and less funny the more videos I've watched.  For me, he seemed like a one trick pony, and that trick is wearing thin.  I still watch his videos to hear what he actually has to say about a game.  He's actually quite good at arguing that some of the games he reviews are complete crap. 

It still has its moments and I still find it entertaining, but yeah, it's pretty tough to keep a show really good with such a basic concept (foul mouthed nerd rants against bad games) going for 90+ episodes. 

Considering this forum's predilections, I think Rolfe's movie reviews might be of interest to people here, particularly his Monster Madness series.  Rolfe is a professional video editor, and it shows in his work. 

http://www.cinemassacre.com/category/moviereviews/ (http://www.cinemassacre.com/category/moviereviews/)

The amount of videos he puts up is staggering.