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Other Topics => Television => Topic started by: clockworkcanary on April 17, 2017, 06:29:03 AM



Title: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: clockworkcanary on April 17, 2017, 06:29:03 AM
So, I'm sure I'm not the only one to binge watch the new season of MST3k.

My overall thoughts: I love it so far.

First, some minor issues:

The intro with the live/fake band singing was a bit over produced for me. There's something I like about the mads being in an isolated, smaller/intimate area, where this was like they had an entire moon base space station celebrating (which, to be fair, it is something to celebrate). Lots of bots breaking out into song, which is popular with some folks I hear (not a fan of musicals).

The first few episodes, the pacing was quick. It's like they just snorted coffee, with rapid-fire jokes (which is a good thing, but they need to let some breathing time in there between the jokes).

The voices take some getting used to (and they are good), but it was annoying having Gypsy drop in and out of the screen and with Servo floating around.

Again, these points are so minor.

Now the good:
Jonah: the new host. I dig him.

The mads: Kinga and Max are pretty great.

The bots: voices might have changed (they have a few times before) but they are the same personalities.

The invention exchanges! Yay!

The spirit: jokes are updated with today's topics, yet it still felt like the same spirit, which is great. It made props to the Joel and Mike years.

The "commercial breaks" -loved that!

The cameos: the non-MST cameos were interesting but really liked seeing old MST characters show up. Grandma, Brain Guy, and Prof Bo Bo showing up was pretty cool, for example.

The movies: out of the couple that I watched all the way through and the others I random-sampled, these movie selections are great! Reptilicus, Avalanche, Starcrash, Yongary, and Cry Wilderness just to name a few.

Overall, as an MST3k fan, I was not disappointed. I hope they continue this show, season after season and generation after generation.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: clockworkcanary on April 19, 2017, 04:59:08 PM
Just watched the finale and all I can say is "well done!" - won't spoil anything, but I can't wait for season 12!



Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: javakoala on April 20, 2017, 01:18:20 PM
Overall, they have done a good job of bringing the series back from the dead. Each episode has been fairly funny to pretty damn funny, so far.

The biggest issues I have are the non-stop barrage of riffs (often close to being stacked on top of each other, with lesser riffs being used in front of better riffs) and the constantly missed opportunities the movies themselves set up (open-ended dialogue that BEGS for a riff, but these guys just sit there waiting for another chance to reference Game of Thrones or Twitter).

Other than that, no major complaints. It would be nice to hear Tom and Crow reference classic riffs from the previous versions, and let Jonah be confused. He is a noob, so he wouldn't know the history those two characters have, yet they have him chime in on references from episodes he would have no knowledge of. Doesn't happen often enough to be an issue, but you'd think they could have sorted that problem before finalizing the scripts.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on April 22, 2017, 03:22:11 PM
I guess I'll put my individual episode comments here instead of the other thread.

1102 - CRY WILDERNESS

This is a perfect type of movie for MST3K: incompetent, badly acted, cheap production values, bizarre plotting, but not too busy with lots of empty places to insert riffs. The plot involves a kid who's friends with Bigfoot, who psychically calls him from boarding school because Dad is in trouble, but it's really more Bigfoot that's in trouble because there's a government-sponsored big game hunter squatting in Dad's cabin. Oh, and there's a tiger on the loose and a wise old Indian ghost, too. In fact, the movie is nearly perfect--just needed a breakout character like Rowsdower or a great running joke to make it into an MST3K classic. Unfortunately, although the movie is much better making the episode more watchable, I didn't laugh much more than I did at the pilot episode. I do suspect this one will have greater replay value and will probably grow on me.

Other thoughts:

*The host segments seem very Joel-inspired: charts and maps explaining the movie, general "wackiness" (bots dressed as raccoons knocking over cereal boxes). Mike host segments tended to be more dialogue based.
*Pearl, Brain Guy and Observer's cameo was welcome, but not really gut-busting, and I was a little disappointed that it didn't add to the backstory about how we got from the end of Season 10 to Season 11. What have Pearl and company been doing all this time (and how long has it been?)
*The movie ends with one of the worst theme songs ever---a country-tinged 80s power ballad. Yuck. Jonah and the bots can't even make it through the credits.

I'd rank the episode overall a little higher than 1101-Reptillicus. It didn't change my opinion of Season 111: it's clearly better than Season 1, but not nearly as good as the sweet spot seasons from Comedy Central (3-6) or the Sci-Fi channel (2nd half of Season 8 - 10). But the pieces are in place for them to take a big leap forward if they get a Season 12.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Sitting Duck on April 23, 2017, 08:13:27 AM
A very apt description I've heard given to Cry Wilderness is Pod People crossed with Boggy Creek 2, and a dash of The Final Sacrifice.

*The host segments seem very Joel-inspired: charts and maps explaining the movie, general "wackiness" (bots dressed as raccoons knocking over cereal boxes). Mike host segments tended to be more dialogue based.

Though the final Red Crow host segment had a definite Mike era tone to it.

Quote
*Pearl, Brain Guy and Observer's cameo was welcome, but not really gut-busting, and I was a little disappointed that it didn't add to the backstory about how we got from the end of Season 10 to Season 11. What have Pearl and company been doing all this time (and how long has it been?)

Though it's amusing to see that her son isn't the only relative she treats in a callous manner.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on April 29, 2017, 12:10:10 PM
1103 - TIME TRAVELERS

Three scientists and a janitor stupidly step through a time travel portal and are trapped in the post-apocalyptic future. There's no running theme to the host segments, which are frankly kind of mediocre, but we do get a (silent) cameo from Joel as one of the scientists from the movie.

Three episodes in, I think I know what I'm going to get with the riffing from Jonah, Baron and Hampton. It's serviceable, although sometimes the delivery is a bit stiff or forced---they don't seem as natural as the classic teams, but that's to be expected since they're learning on the job. It looks like my enjoyment of these episodes is going to depend on the strength/craziness of the movie. And TIME TRAVELERS, unfortunately, is a weak, cliched flick. Just a bunch of white scientists encountering an "alien" civilization (it struck me that the plot was similar to the also-bland PHANTOM PLANET, with "the future" substituting for "another planet.") This is the weakest of the three episodes I've seen so far.

One thing that was odd was the violence in the fight scene. I remember a hatchet getting buried in a mutants chest. I think that's the goriest scene I've ever seen on MST3K.

I hope there's a Season 12 because I do see a lot of promise here, and I think once they have a chance to refine it they'll be back to where they were when the show left off.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on April 29, 2017, 12:28:23 PM
(https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.net/mst3k/pages/249/attachments/original/1493335958/cry_wilderness_supercuts.gif?1493335958)

I missed this joke somehow when I watched the episode. Good one!


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on May 06, 2017, 02:15:43 PM
1104 - AVALANCHE

A nice change-of-pace movie: a (relatively) star-studded (a paunchy Rock Hudson and a scrawny Mia Farroe) 70s disaster movie. The movie itself was just mediocre---it had a made-for-TV quality about it, even though it was a theatrical release---but it's easy to follow and causes no major pain.

Everything continues to have a real "Joel" feeling about it. Lots of gizmos and gimmicks (liquid technology, new bit features, sight gags) that were always in his wheelhouse. The tone of this season reminds me most of Season 2.

I always wondered how they were going to handle nudity if it ever came up. I like the solution.

I didn't think the musical number was especially funny, but it was very well-done.

Glad they took at shot at SHARKNADO and imitators. I'll have to go back and pause the screen for those titles.

Apparently this is a season 11 favorite on the MST3K fan sites. I'd rank it below CRY WILDERNESS, in line with REPTILLICUS, ahead of TIME TRAVELERS. The riffing is still not up to classic levels, in my opinion, but it is better than the worst episodes. Still waiting to see my personal breakthrough episode, but I'm generally pleased.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: javakoala on May 06, 2017, 04:32:35 PM
I have stalled on the Hercules episode. I'm losing my interest in general, and this steaming turd of a boring film is NOT helping. I've managed to watch all but the last 15 minutes of this episode, and it has taken me nearly three weeks to push myself this far.

Still stunned by all the missed opportunities given by dialogue in the films, yet they fill dead air with cliche squeaky noises when someone walks. Snap out of it, guys. I know you can do better!


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: clockworkcanary on May 06, 2017, 05:19:55 PM
At the moment, I'm enjoying Wizards of the Lost Kingdom I and II a lot. Our whole family was reacting well (even the always bored 13 year old). Even the kids were enjoying it, which is something I was curious about.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Sitting Duck on May 08, 2017, 02:02:06 PM
Everything continues to have a real "Joel" feeling about it.

There are some Mike-style bits. As well as Red Crow mentioned previously, there's the Never Have I Ever sketch and the Time Portal Safety Lecture. Having had to sit through many a workplace lecture that employed tortured acronyms, the latter was a particular favorite.

I have stalled on the Hercules episode. I'm losing my interest in general, and this steaming turd of a boring film is NOT helping. I've managed to watch all but the last 15 minutes of this episode, and it has taken me nearly three weeks to push myself this far.

I'm pacing myself at one episode every Sunday afternoon, so I can't speak from experience yet. However, the buzz I've been hearing other places is that the Hercules episode is the low point of the season.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: HappyGilmore on May 12, 2017, 09:47:47 PM
I just finished Carnival Magic, episode 12. Fantastic. Really hit their stride here. Riff wise, and some plot points with the Forrester clan, don't wanna say more.

Started episode 13. Seems to be setting up another season. 🤔


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on May 13, 2017, 06:05:50 PM
1105 - BEAST OF HOLLOW MOUNTAIN

Mexican ranchers discover a beast has been eating their cattle. The beast, however, is nowhere to be found for half the movie: instead we have a romantic subplot and the antics of a comic drunk and his cute kid.

This is the low point of the season for me so far. Very boring movie; it picks up when the monster shows up for the last 20 minutes but it was too late for me to care much. I barely laughed at all and the host segments did nothing for me. I am still looking forward to STARCRASH next week, though.

Here's a bonus for ya:

http://youtu.be/Ot6NEtlwkRI (http://youtu.be/Ot6NEtlwkRI)

Netflix made more of these little Tom & Crow skits, which I think is a good sign for a possible Season 12.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Sitting Duck on May 17, 2017, 02:07:00 PM
We have Road Tour Sign!

 (http://youtu.be/n-knOUtUQ9Q)


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on May 20, 2017, 02:16:59 PM
STARCRASH: Space bikini-clad Stella Star goes on galaxy saving missions while her much more competent psychic navigator stays behind in the spaceship so he can come in and save her ass; when he dies, David Hosselhoff fills in. Not too much going on outside the movie, but Jerry Seinfeld shows up for the (not especially funny) cameo. I think the riffing was actually a little weak on this one, not up to the levels of CRY WILDERNESS or AVALANCHE, but this is my personal favorite so far because of the underlying movie (I can watch Caroline Munro in a bikini all day).

Complaint of the week: the theater is getting too busy with the silhouettes. Gypsy dropping in twice an episode is OK, but she hasn't gotten a funny line yet. Tom flying hasn't added anything, and now they've got Crow standing up, and several times the bots get up and start walking to the exits. It's all distracting. Sit still and watch the movie!


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: javakoala on May 20, 2017, 04:40:37 PM
Complaint of the week: the theater is getting too busy with the silhouettes. Gypsy dropping in twice an episode is OK, but she hasn't gotten a funny line yet. Tom flying hasn't added anything, and now they've got Crow standing up, and several times the bots get up and start walking to the exits. It's all distracting. Sit still and watch the movie!

Welcome to Generation ADHD!! If you don't have it, we'll condition your brain to mimic it!

By the way, I agree, Rev. I have to keep reminding myself that they are now catering to a different demographic than the original shows. Still annoys the s**t out of me.  :teddyr:


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on May 20, 2017, 05:07:26 PM
Complaint of the week: the theater is getting too busy with the silhouettes. Gypsy dropping in twice an episode is OK, but she hasn't gotten a funny line yet. Tom flying hasn't added anything, and now they've got Crow standing up, and several times the bots get up and start walking to the exits. It's all distracting. Sit still and watch the movie!

Welcome to Generation ADHD!! If you don't have it, we'll condition your brain to mimic it!

By the way, I agree, Rev. I have to keep reminding myself that they are now catering to a different demographic than the original shows. Still annoys the s**t out of me.  :teddyr:

So am I officially a cranky old man now? "Hey you kids, stop playing with those bots on my lawn!"


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: HappyGilmore on May 22, 2017, 09:08:19 PM
Tom flying around had a couple moments of laughter from me in some later films this season, same with them hitting the exits.  Is it my age? I'm 33, so probably a tad younger than some here (no offense.)  However I grew up with the original show and see where everyone's coming from.  But I think they're trying to write for both old and new fans, so.  Anything to get new seasons, guys. :wink:

I dug the new season overall.  Hearing it's a definite for season 12, so.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Sitting Duck on May 23, 2017, 02:09:33 PM
So am I officially a cranky old man now?

I'm afraid so. Next thing you know, you'll be complaining about them talking over the movie. :tongueout: And truth be told, it's not much different from the original. Particularly during Joel's time as host, they would sometimes mime interacting with whatever was on the screen. It's just that now they can do stuff that wasn't possible for a cowtown puppet show back in the Nineties.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on May 27, 2017, 01:55:17 PM
THE LAND THAT TIME FORGOT: Refugees from a torpedoed ship commandeer a German U-boat and sail it to a continent where dinosaurs and cavemen live side by side. Another mediocre (not bad) monster movie, which is bad news for the riffing possibilities. (They try to go after Doug McClure, but he's too bland to effectively mock). They try hard with the host segments: the "dinosaur BBQ" sketch almost works, yet I didn't actually laugh. This ranks as my second least-favorite episode of the new season, only ahead of BEAST OF HOLLOW MOUNTAIN.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on June 03, 2017, 12:06:19 PM
THE LOVES OF HERCULES: Bad guys kill Herc's wife, but Jayne Mansfield catches him on the rebound. The movie features the worst Hercules in Mickey Hartigay (aside from Lou Ferrigno) and the worst monster I've ever seen in any peplum: a three-headed hydra that looks like a bad parade float. I liked the movie! Wish they'd made more jokes about Jayne's, em, endowments. Mr. Waverly appears for the first time: huh. Surprised that so many people seem to dislike this one, I'd rank it in the middle of the season 12 pack.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on June 10, 2017, 03:44:32 PM
YONGARY: A monster stomps Seoul. Routine kaiju action, with the only twists being a itchy ray and the monster's long, painful-looking death scene (that goes on forever). Still, the riffing was some of the best of the season, though the best parts are loaded towards the beginning of the episode ("CAPSULE"?) Host segments are short and unspectacular, although the song at the end almost works. Probably ends up in the lower third of the season. A more interesting movie would have helped a lot.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on June 17, 2017, 01:03:50 PM
WIZARDS OF THE LOST KINGDOM: A miscast wino hero (Bo Svenson) helps a weenie wizard kid and his wooly Wookie pet get his kingdom back from an evil usurper. On Moon 13, Max declares his love for Kinga (to his diary) and discovers some sort of beast that may (or may not) do his bidding later in the series. This 80s D&D/STAR WARS kiddie hybrid is my brand of cheese, so I naturally enjoyed this one. An upper middle episode in the new series' run. And there's a sequel next week, let's hope that's even worse!


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: javakoala on June 17, 2017, 06:18:27 PM
WIZARDS OF THE LOST KINGDOM: A miscast wino hero (Bo Svenson) helps a weenie wizard kid and his wooly Wookie pet get his kingdom back from an evil usurper. On Moon 13, Max declares his love for Kinga (to his diary) and discovers some sort of beast that may (or may not) do his bidding later in the series. This 80s D&D/STAR WARS kiddie hybrid is my brand of cheese, so I naturally enjoyed this one. An upper middle episode in the new series' run. And there's a sequel next week, let's hope that's even worse!

The movie itself is. The riffing is about the same level.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on June 24, 2017, 01:38:04 PM
As Java said:

WIZARDS OF THE LOST KINGDOM 2: A crummy wizard trains a boy in magic to overthrow three evil wizards. On Moon 13, Kinga comes up with a new ratings boost plan: she'll marry Jonah! The movie is totally different, yet completely indistinguishable, from WIZARDS OF THE LOST KINGDOM 1. David Carradine looks bored and somehow makes an even worse epic fantasy hero than Bo Svenson, but it was fun to see Sid Haig (and extra fun to see the BARBARIAN QUEEN herself, Lana Clarkson!) Like I said, this is almost indistinguishable from the first one, but as an episode I'd rank it slightly ahead of that one because of the welcome return of Pearl, Bobo and Observer, and the start of what I presume/hope will be a plot arc with Kinga's threat of a sham marriage.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on July 01, 2017, 02:43:11 PM
CARNIVAL MAGIC: A mystical magician and his sorta-talking chimp sidekick become the star attractions of a small-time carnival, arousing jealousy in the former headliner. Also, Kinga announces her plan to marry Jonah, and the SOL gets a surprise visitor. Finally, I have a clear favorite episode from Season 11! This is the first one I would rank as competitive with an average show from seasons 2-10. Bizarre movie, good riffing, good host segments, memorable cameo from Mark Hamill, and continuing development of a plot arc add up to more fun than a talking monkey sideshow!


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: javakoala on July 01, 2017, 04:03:39 PM
CARNIVAL MAGIC: A mystical magician and his sorta-talking chimp sidekick become the star attractions of a small-time carnival, arousing jealousy in the former headliner. Also, Kinga announces her plan to marry Jonah, and the SOL gets a surprise visitor. Finally, I have a clear favorite episode from Season 11! This is the first one I would rank as competitive with an average show from seasons 2-10. Bizarre movie, good riffing, good host segments, memorable cameo from Mark Hamill, and continuing development of a plot arc add up to more fun than a talking monkey sideshow!

Let's not forget that the one and (thank goodness) ONLY Al Adamson directed that limp noodle of a movie. I've owned it on BD for nearly two years and never could stand more than 20 minutes of it. Only with the help of MST3K was I able to watch the whole thing.

YES!! Mark Hamill was wonderful in the guest role. Another thing that helped make the whole thing very watchable.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: AoTFan on July 07, 2017, 04:33:12 PM
So, I'm sure I'm not the only one to binge watch the new season of MST3k.

Is this on cable, Netflix, Hulu, or what?


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: javakoala on July 08, 2017, 01:20:04 AM
So, I'm sure I'm not the only one to binge watch the new season of MST3k.

Is this on cable, Netflix, Hulu, or what?

Netflix has the reboot season, plus a season's worth of older episodes from the original series.

Does that answer your question, or have I muddied the water? I'm good at that.  :bouncegiggle: :bouncegiggle:


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on July 08, 2017, 03:27:00 PM
THE CHRISTMAS THAT ALMOST WASN'T: Santa Claus hires a pro-bono lawyer because his kid-hating landlord is threatening to evict him from his North Pole workshop before he can make all the toys, thereby making Christmas almost not. Not a fun movie or a good episode, which is made even more unfortunate by the fact that it's going to be compared against the two classic Christmas MST3K episodes. Riffing is OK but a bit labored: they had a running "adult baby" joke about the barrister but it seemed completely arbitrary. One of the bottom three episodes of the season, with only one left to go.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: javakoala on July 08, 2017, 07:05:33 PM
THE CHRISTMAS THAT ALMOST WASN'T: Santa Claus hires a pro-bono lawyer because his kid-hating landlord is threatening to evict him from his North Pole workshop before he can make all the toys, thereby making Christmas almost not. Not a fun movie or a good episode, which is made even more unfortunate by the fact that it's going to be compared against the two classic Christmas MST3K episodes. Riffing is OK but a bit labored: they had a running "adult baby" joke about the barrister but it seemed completely arbitrary. One of the bottom three episodes of the season, with only one left to go.

Agreed.

I think I almost would have had more fun watching this movie without them. They pile the riffs on top of each other and hope something sticks. On a movie this bad, you pretty much need a unified effort to create riffs that build on each other, not fire off like a shotgun and hope for the best.

Damn kids!!


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Rev. Powell on July 15, 2017, 08:07:02 PM
AT THE EARTH'S CORE: Doug McClure and Peter Cushing ride their Iron Mole to the earth's core, where they find prehistoric monsters, humanoid slavers, and primitive English-speaking tribes. The movie is OK, colorful and almost psychedelic with its underground fungi forests, although it makes little sense. McClure is an uninspiring action hero, poor aging Cushing is silly as comic relief, and Caroline Munro shows up as eye candy. What makes this episode memorable are the host segments, particularly the wild cliffhanger wedding finale with unexpected guests. In fact, although not the best riffing or movie, I think the ending makes this my favorite episode of the season. Having finally seen them all I'd rank them:

1114 AT THE EARTH'S CORE
1112 CARNIVAL MAGIC
1106 STARCRASH
1102 CRY WILDERNESS
1101 REPTILICUS
1108 THE LOVES OF HERCULES
1111 WIZARDS OF THE LOST KINGDOM 2
1110 WIZARDS OF THE LOST KINGDOM
1104 AVALANCHE
1103 TIME TRAVELERS
1109 YONGARY
1113 THE CHRISTMAS THAT ALMOST WASN'T
1107 THE LAND THE TIME FORGOT
1105 THE BEAST OF HOLLOW MOUNTAIN

I have a feeling that AVALANCHE and CRY WILDERNESS are going to improve on a second viewing.

Season 11 was good enough that I want Season 12, which means it was a success for me, even though the best episodes were only average for the series' run and the worst were among some of the worst ever. I suspect they will be renewed and will come back stronger. This new crew did better than the Season 1 crew and about on par with the first half of Season 8.


Title: Re: Mystery Science Theater The Return (Season 11)
Post by: Sitting Duck on July 21, 2017, 02:15:19 PM
I too have finished the new season and have ranked them in order of preference. Mine is somewhat different from yours, though.

Starcrash
Wizards of the Lost Kingdom 2
Wizards of the Lost Kingdom 1
At the Earth's Core
The Land That Time Forgot
The Time Travellers
The Beast of Hollow Mountain
The Loves of Hercules
Reptilicus
The Christmas That Almost Wasn't
Avalanche
Yongary
Cry Wilderness
Carnival Magic

My comparatively high ranking for Beast of Hollow Mountain is partially due to how I have a soft spot in my heart for weird Westerns. Even if it's plainly a conventional Western with the weird element sloppily tacked on to the end. As for my ranking Carnival Magic dead last, I find it had too much in common with my least favorite genre of film seen on MST3K, Sordid Crime. Now I don't hate all Sordid Crime episodes (the earnestness of I Accuse My Parents and the Seventies camp of Mitchell make them more palatable). But by and large, I find such films to be about greasy, loathsome people being greasy and loathsome. Mark Hamill as a singing interstellar carnie was a hoot, though.