Badmovies.org Forum

It's always kind of irked me when celebrities endorse political candidates or controversial causes. They're not real people; they're paid obscene ammounts of money to play make believe, so who are they to tell us norms how to vote? Also, most politically outspoken celebs make crappy movies, so their opinion does not matter. Take Alec Baldwin. He hasn't been in a good movie since The Hunt For Red October, twelve years ago.

On the other hand, Arnold Schwarzenegger and Bruce Willis campaigned for President Bush, and in retrospect that was fitting, since they both know a thing or two about killing terrorists. But that doesn't erase the fact that they were in Batman And Robin and The Bonfire Of The Vanities, respectively.

             I thoroughly enjoyed the way The Rock played both sides of the political card in 2000,first promting himself at the Republican convention(where he happily boasted about himself,and nothing more but about himself),and then appearing at the Democratic convention,angering the Republicans for using their stand as much of a self-promotion vehicle,as much as he did with the Democrats.
            Both of those partys' top political candidates were extremely,extremely lame-o,for that political year,BTW.

Join Arnold! (http://www.joinarnold.com/Message.htm) Hear a message from Arnold! Schwa-chan (as he is known in Japan where he hawks caffine-laden "health" drinks) is plugging away on behalf of a California "after-school" program initiative. Kindergarten Cop!

"Law & Order" uber-babe Jill Hennessy did a commercial recently for some political cause, but I forget what it was because I was too busy wondering what she cooks like naked.

But honestly, actors and actresses are human beings like everyone else; their profession shouldn't bar them from politics. Ronald Reagan, Charlton Heston, Ed Asner, Sonny...uh...Bono...um, "Bono"...you get the idea. True, Hollywooden nutjobs who already have broad media access can abuse it to push their own wiggy agendas and beliefs, but sometimes they can do good as well.

Actually, the reverse is also true: political figures and pundits have become a new form of celebrity, which I do see as a very bad thing. When politics become exclusively a form of entertainment, we are totally screwed. Political debate should have more importance than the outcome of a sitcom episode or a scripted "wrestling" match.

What bugs me about it is that their endorsement really shouldn't mean anymore than my endorsement, or anyone else's.  Maybe even less, because it's unlikely that they will be adversely affected by political or economic changes.

What bugs me about it is that their endorsement really shouldn't mean anymore than my endorsement, or anyone else's. Maybe even less, because it's unlikely that they will be adversely affected by political or economic changes.
*****  Sad fact is that "celebrity awe" is a very real, very damaging fact of American life.  How else could Hillary Clinton get elected to ANYTHING.  I think it's a holdover to Old World royalty.  Something instinctive inside us as a people urges us to follow the blithering twit with the funny hair who is in the public eye all the time.  Unfortunately, now we are listening to the court jesters which may be even worse than royalty.

Of course no thinking person would allow a movie star's endorsement to effect their vote any more than they'd allow a pro football player's endorsement to impact their appreciation of 18th Century French poetry.  But a lot of people don't think all the time.

I don't mind if celebrities are politically active.  Doesn't sway me one way or the other.  But then I don't follow the lives of celebrities like the media wants me too.  Could care less what Alec Baldwin and Kim Basinger are up to, let alone which way they're voting this year.

No, the thing that irks me is when movies have a thinly veiled political agenda behind them.  Take the movie JUST CAUSE.  It opens with Sean Connery having the most asinine debate with George Plimpton about the death penalty.  It doesn't contain any real arguments.  It begins from the hack screenwriter's belief that the death penalty is wrong and what he imagines anybody for it must sound like.  Awful.  I didn't watch the rest of the movie.

Or the movie IT'S THE RAGE.  Interesting ensemble cast, so I picked it up.  Turns out the entire thing is an argument against gun ownership.  Why didn't they say that on the back of the box?  I thought I was going to watch a real movie, not be talked down to by some dumbass Hollywood director.

I don't have this problem if a movie has an out-and-out political agenda.  Or if a movie handles it subtext head-on and with grace.  But when it's done badly, you've got a recipe for some of the worst movies ever made.

It's The Rage is awful. There's also Citizen Ruth and If These Walls Could Talk, which depict anyone even remotely pro-life as a complete raving idiot.

Actually, America is really the only culture that celebrates celebrity so. Is it because we need something to bow down before? I remember wall-to-wall coverage of the anniversary of JFK Jr.'s death. Isn't there real news to be covered?

JR:  Actually, America is really the only culture that celebrates celebrity so.

*****  JR I have to TOTALLY disagree with you here!  Have you ever seen a British newspaper??  Japan also comes close to equalling our mania for celebrity.  Italy and India are two other countries that go nuts for that stuff.  Then consider countries that still have gigantic billboards with pictures of Mao on them every fifty yards.  Go to any south American country and see how people act when you mention a famous soccer player's name.  

We're bad, I'll grant you, but we are not alone.

"Sad fact is that "celebrity awe" is a very real, very damaging fact of American life. How else could Hillary Clinton get elected to ANYTHING. I think it's a holdover to Old World royalty. Something instinctive inside us as a people urges us to follow the blithering twit with the funny hair who is in the public eye all the time. Unfortunately, now we are listening to the court jesters which may be even worse than royalty."

Indeed. Just look at George The Second.

"There's an old saying in Tennessee....(long pause)...I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee...(pause)...that says, fool me once, shame on...(long pause)...shame on you. Fool me...(very long pause, confused worried look)...you can't get fooled again."
--Our Vegetable-In-Chief

I'd have to agree with the notion that some people are far too interested in celebrities - what they do in their private lives, what they think about things, how they vote, their love lives, etc.

Sure the media exposure makes it awfully tempting to abuse your fame and get on a soapbox, but it's when you start listening to  the morons who attach extra value to your opinion that things go wrong. Fame does not mean someone automatically knows what they're talking about. Really, why should I give a rat's ass what a singer has to say about anything other than music, or what an actor does outside of his movies?

That was one of the things that really p**sed me off any time I watched Politically Incorrect. Somebody who really understood an issue would be debating against some bubbleheaded actress who clearly had the audience behind her in spite of not having a clue what she was talking about. They were taking wise-ass remarks as equal to solid arguments.

Very much agreed there, AndyC. I tuned in once, which turned out to be the worst possible moment--one similar to what you described. Political satire is great, but while the reduction of serious political issues to a stand-up-comedian version of "Crossfire" may have made for laughs, anyone who really cared about the issues probably got fed up with it immediately. (Not that "Crossfire" treats the issues much better...just with less wit.)

I concur on Politically Incorrect. Real, knowledgable experts were shot down before they could complete a sentence in favor of one-liners from dim actresses and the king of all that is wrong in this country, Bill Maher. I wouldn't be surprised if he favored child abuse. I once saw an episode where he was drooling all over Jennifer Tilly, remarking on how astoundingly intelligent she is and applauding when she said, "Bush isn't smart,".

During the 2000 elections Gore was actually so desperate for votes he had Gwyneth Paltrow and Ben Affliction CALLING PEOPLE to get them to vote for him. If I were behind a candidate and one of them called me supporting that candidate I'd switch my vote ASAP.

And Squish, we get it. You don't like Bush. Very on-the-nose.

Actually, I think CITIZEN RUTH was sorta even-handed....at least more so than most movies.  They at least made fun of the pro-choice activists somewhat, showing that they were less interested in Ruth exercising a choice than in wanting her to get an abortion.

> Fame does not mean someone automatically knows what
> they're talking about. Really, why should I give a rat's ass
> what a singer has to say about anything other than music,
> or what an actor does outside of his movies?

I agree!  Why would I care how Justin Timberlake or Ben Affleck are voting?  Just because thier famous doesn't mean I actually value anything that they say.  Honestly, I really don't care if they give to a charity or if they help out with charity work (even if it's only their celebrity stature that generates more money or people) because their doing it for a good cause.  If they use thier fame to fight for something (Michael J Fox), or if they are to become an average joe like me & you to get something done then great.  It crosses the line when all they do is get on tv and downtalk to us like they know exactly what's best for the world.

What's really funny is when they're sole purpose for being at a political rally (or whatever) is to be a decoration.  "See, Sharon Stone is supporting me! Vote for me!"    HA HA HA...give me a break.....

I do, however, admire the celebrities that take an "real" intrest in politics (like Jesse Ventura).  Rather than those who only want to pust their own agendas (abortion, disarmament..ect..) or just to be seen.

Quite right. There are some celebrities who know what they're talking about, because they learned and gained experience in an area. Jesse Ventura is a good example. He started with municipal politics and worked his way up, being elected governor and doing the job. I would no longer class him as a politically active celebrity, but as a politician, since his political career came after his wrestling career. He's proven himself to be more than a famous face. The same can be said of the late Sonny Bono, Fred 'Gopher' Grandy and Ronald Reagan, among others. Like them or not, they earned the right to be called politicians.

I think the difference is in actually putting yourself in the position of authority and making the tough decisions, rather than making off-the-cuff remarks on a talk show between movie shoots. It's very safe to be opinionated when you aren't responsible.

Mofo Riseing reminded me of something. My friend Barbra is blind, and some times gets to "See" movies by the audio description service. Good deal.
....Anyway, she watched "An American President" Did not like it. Not that it was badly put together, but that she does not like movies that try to push an agenda.
....Barb's less conservtive then me, but she has a low tolerance for people who try to bulls**t. Why we're close friends confuses me too. Seriously, she did not like the simple way it presented the opponents of M. Douglas's character.
....She reconised the "Straw man" at work. She's too smart to be taken in by slick ad work. When your blind, you have to know who you can trust, and she pays attention to what people say. She's very perceptive. I trust her.
....Hummm...theres a thought. Try listening to a movie. I've a tape of the soundtrack of Plan 9. Its even funnier then watching it,for me. the line "Well, inspector grey is dead...murdered...and someone's responsable!" makes an impression with out the visual destraction., in a way we sighted people don't often realise. Give it a try, and see what you make of it.

Barbra 'Babs' Streisand sent off a memo to Dick Gephardt about how to best handle the Saddam Hussein issue.  But the letter spelled both Gephardt's and Saddam's names incorrectly, thus shooting the credibility of her stance full of holes.  Whoever wrote that for her is probably looking for a different job right about now.

Sheesh.

Gore's speech blasting Bush's handling of the war from last week was co-written by Rob Reiner.  One Washington Post editorial remarked:  "America's prosecution of the war is the combined effort of Donald Rumsfeld, Dick Chency, Colin Powell, Condoleeza Rice and the President.  Meanwhile Gore is huddling with Meathead."

Priceless.

Good God. Reiner?! He made The Story Of Us! I wouldn't be surprised if Tom Hanks, Ted Danson and Whoopi Goldberg were allowed into Clinton's cabinet meetings. I remeber a statment Babs made just after the 2000 election that sounded too much like a call for Bush's assassination. She needs a gun-butt to the kidney for thinking anyone would care what she had to say about politics.

Jeez, what an ego! Barbara Streisand giving advice on handling Saddam Hussein to someone who understands the issue far better than she does. It's laughable. People certainly have a right to write to their government officials, but why should her letter carry any more weight than a letter from any other citizen?

I've never quite understood the appeal of Streisand anyway. Don't like her singing or her acting, and she looks like Mel Brooks in drag. I can't say she's done anything worth noting in the entertainment business lately. She has been pretty obnoxious in the media. Why do so many people flip over her? Why does any of this qualify her to advise government officials?

I think the biggest problem with celebrities is that they reach a point where people idolize them for who they are, rather than admire what they do. Their names carry more weight than their work.

AndyC wrote:  Don't like her singing or her acting, and she looks like Mel Brooks in drag.
*****  Priceless.  Andy, I'm gonna use that.

"I've never quite understood the appeal of Streisand anyway. Don't like her singing or her acting, and she looks like Mel Brooks in drag."

Man, that's just MEAN!  What did Mel Brooks ever do to you?
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How come only the "reputable" stars ever come out with their politics? Spielberg, streisand, tom cruise. I don't care to hear their endorsements either way. But....when it comes to war in Iraq, right wing conspiracy, the budget...where are all the Pauly Shores and carrot tops? Now that would almost be worth watching CNN for. ;-)

Latest poll from Hollywood:

Spielberg, Tom Cruise: pro-war with Iraq.

Jessica Lange, Streisand, Alec Baldwin: against war with Iraq.

Alec Baldwin?  Didn't he say he was leaving the country if Bush was ever president?  Man, doesn't a person's word mean ANYTHING anymore?

Dano wrote:
>
> Alec Baldwin?  Didn't he say he was leaving the country if
> Bush was ever president?  Man, doesn't a person's word mean
> ANYTHING anymore?
>

So did Babs, I believe.  And Robert Altman, as well.  Oh well, I don't watch their stuff anyway...although I do check out Mr. Streisand (aka James Brolin) regularly in The Car and The Amityville Horror.

Robert Altman, director of the long, boring, pretentious and pointless Gosford Park. God, I hated that movie. I was willing to give it a chance, but it was over an hour into the thing before I saw any sign of a plot. I can think of very few movies during which I dozed off (without being especially tired or drunk), and this is one of them.

Remember last year, when Altman was shamelessly promoting this piece of crap by spouting some BS about action movies being responsible for 9/11, and how we all needed a return to character-driven movies? That was in very poor taste.

Hmm, could we threaten Iraq with Pauly Shore & Carrot Top?  "We will broadcast their movies/tv shows/commercials until you remove Saddam."  

Nah, that's gotta be against the Geneva Convention.

AndyC wrote:  Robert Altman, director of the long, boring, pretentious and pointless Gosford Park. God, I hated that movie. I was willing to give it a chance, but it was over an hour into the thing before I saw any sign of a plot. I can think of very few movies during which I dozed off (without being especially tired or drunk), and this is one of them.

*****  I'm in the habit of leaving movies I'm not enjoying on any level.  Gosford Park was one of them.  I never saw the conclusion of the movie, but even I can tell you it was the young dark haired valet who was no doubt the old man's bastard son who grew up in abject poverty because the guy wouldn't acknowledge him (or some variation of that).  It was the most sub-par mystery of the last ten years, and keep in mind, that means it was a worse mystery than Live Action Scooby Doo.

As for it's biting (heavy-handed) commentary on Britain's rigid social structure (as it existed almost a century ago)... yawn.  That's kind of like saterizing the wrongness of divine right monarchy - kind of a hard target to miss and not very relevent today... but at least Hollywood will applaud your "courageous" effort.

Actually, the Pauly Shore-Carrot Top plan is the real Win-Win strategy! There are many outcomes:

(1) Saddam declares that he is a Carrot Top fan, and is promptly assassinated by his own people to prevent the country from becoming a laughingstock.
(2) Saddam becomes so confused, trying to determine what's supposed to be so funny about this American "comedian" Shore, that his head bursts into flames.
(3) Saddam kills Pauly Shore and Carrot Top by first lowering them slowly into a pit of man-eating pigs...and then shooting them when the pigs flee in disgust.  

No, wait...there's one horrifying possibility:
(4) Saddam clones Pauly Shore and Carrot Top by the hundreds and parachutes them all over every major western city. The ensuing panic brings the nations to their knees.

No...the danger is too great.

We should have an open Top/Shore/Saddam/Bush debate.

Shore- "Like, I think we should use inspectors, buh-deee. It's like, inspect-age, nyuh-huh-huh."

Top- "Know what? Saddam's got missiles! Just look at this nuclear detector I made out of a rake and a Game Boy! Whoa! Whoa, magod! It's goin' crazy! Wha!!!"

Saddam- "Now do you see why I hate America?"

Bush- "If I have these guys deported to a country where they stone people like that..."

Saddam- "All-encompassing peace treaty,"

Here's an exerpt from CNN:

>>An Iraqi vice president offered an unusual suggestion Thursday for solving the U.S.-Iraq standoff: Saddam Hussein and George W. Bush should fight a duel to settle their differences and spare their people the ravages of war.

U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan would be the referee for the duel, which should be held on neutral territory, Vice President Taha Yassin Ramadan told Associated Press Television Network in an interview.
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Celebrity deathmatch?

Bush declined