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Author Topic: Cops are D-bags.  (Read 6003 times)
asimpson2006
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« Reply #15 on: May 02, 2008, 06:19:33 AM »

I agree with ulthar about skaters getting a bad rap.

I live in downtown Cedar Rapids, Iowa and during the warmer months, there's not a whole lot to do here for the younger kids.
So they like to skate downtown here in the parkades and on pretty much anything made of cement.
I live in a highrise building and a 9 story circular (downward spiral) parkade is attached to my building.
Skaters love to skate around here and especially in the parkade.
The bad thing is that the managers of my building and the owners of the parkade hate the skaters.
They call the cops on them anytime they even get a glimpse of one and I never understood why.

They're just kids having fun.

Once, around 2 or 3 in the morning, I came home to find some skaters hanging out near my parking space on level 9 and I talked to them for a few minutes.
They seemed really cool and were only there at that time of night because it affords them a great view of the city and they knew the cops would get called on them if they skated there during daylight hours.
I told them that I didn't mind them skating in the parkade as long as they didn't mess with anyone's cars or "tagged" the walls with grafitti. (which has happened before) and they were totally cool with that.
They weren't hoodlums looking for trouble.  They just wanted a cool place to skate and I told them that I respected that and told them that I wouldn't tell anyone that they were skating in the parkade so late at night.
They respected me for being so understanding.
I told them that if they see anyone messing with my car to f**k them up for me and they said they would.   Wink

As for bad cops...
Yes, there are good ones and bad ones.
Fortunately, most of the cops in my city are pretty good.  They're family men just like most of us here.
If they've got a bad attitude, then they seriously need a vacation.
I've found that when it comes to dealing with the cops, it's all in how you talk to them.

I don't have a problem with skaters either, unless it's with something I own, then I may have a problem.  There are always going to be cops who are good and ones who are not so good.  It's just like any other profession (Business, Retail, IT, etc..)

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« Reply #16 on: May 02, 2008, 07:59:22 AM »

they remind me of guys who would throw me up against lockers in high school.

Yeah, that's pretty much my opinion of cops too.  They seem like jock douchebags, all grown up. 

My experience with cops:  DWI.  Read the police report afterwards, everything was exaggerated to the point of absurdity.  For instance, they arrested me when I was parked.  The back end of the car was maybe 2-3 feet from the curb, the front end was against the curb.  Police report stated I was parked "nearly perpendicular to the curb".  Can't remember what else was in there, but the whole thing was like that.

Me and my buddy, sitting in a park having a few beers.  I guess you weren't supposed to drink there, though it was one of the more popular activities in town.  So these two cops start treating us like escaped prison convicts.  "YOU!  I TOLD YOU TO STAND THERE!!!"  "YOU!  I TOLD YOU TO SIT DOWN OVER THERE!!!"  Good grief, me and my buddy were a couple of the mellowest two guys you'd ever wanna meet. 

Sitting at the park once again, this time a Saturday afternoon.  We're smoking pot and laughing at the silly cops.  The entire parking lot was full of them, about 8 cars worth.  They were hanging out there for hours.  The two lane street was packed with cars, bumper to bumper.  Some guy spins his tires just a little bit.  One of the cops gets in his car and proceeds to drive down the street, forcing about 100 cars off the road, so he can arrest this guy for the grand crime of chirping his tires.  I mean, the cop nearly caused a whole lot of accidents to do this.  Another one goes haulin' ass down the bike path in his cop SUV, joggers go running for their lives in all directions.

Old girlfriend in high school.  Her dad's an ex-cop.  Beats the hell out of her whenever he pleases.

Place I used to work, guy is introduced as an ex-cop.  Yup, he's got the personality.   Came off as a real a-hole at first, but once I got to know him he wasn't really bad at all.

I'm sure they're not all a-holes, but maybe 50-50. 

One good experience with cops:  Three of us were parked in this empty area, sort of in the woods a bit.  Cops pull up, inform us it's private property.  We had no idea, and they were very cool about it, saying that it wasn't marked, so they don't blame us for not knowing.  We had empty beer cans tossed all over the place, they actually picked them up for us.  We weren't driving, and hadn't been seen driving, so they couldn't get us for anything.  They gave us Breathalyzer tests to see if we were legal to drive, we weren't.  We said we'd walk home and they drove away.  We waited five minutes and drove home.  Now those guys were pretty cool.  Maybe because we had a pretty girl along? 

Now I'm 43 and haven't had any experience with cops in at least 15 or 20 years, so my opinion of them has mellowed. 

On a side note, I've noticed that pretty women seem to get along pretty well with the legal system.  I used to have a girlfriend who got arrested for something, and she was supposed to do community service.  Well, she did about 1/5th of it, then she had to go back to court.  She was all worried that she'd get thrown in jail, but the judge just said, oh, that's okay.  You can skip the rest of it.   TeddyR
« Last Edit: May 02, 2008, 08:42:38 AM by Jack » Logged

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« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2008, 09:50:20 AM »

  Now those guys were pretty cool.  Maybe because we had a pretty girl along? 


I be willing to bet my comic collection on them going soft on you fellas because an atractive woman was nearby. Pricks. Man, if I had a pair of tatas, i wouldn't have any propblems.
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« Reply #18 on: May 02, 2008, 10:07:45 AM »

Thatnks for the advice, Ulthar.
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« Reply #19 on: May 02, 2008, 10:37:14 AM »

.
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AndyC
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« Reply #20 on: May 02, 2008, 10:49:01 AM »

Not much I can add that hasn't already been said except that there are reasons why property owners wouldn't want skateboarders hanging around. At the top of the list would be the jump in premiums if their insurance company became aware that unsupervised youngsters were using the property for some activity that could result in personal injury. Not saying it's reasonable, but that's what insurance companies do.

And insurance companies do that because of the second reason - legal liability. Somebody screws around on private property, gets hurt and sues the owner. Or their parents sue the owner. You might not be a litigious person, but enough people are. And even if it isn't an injury related to skateboarding, that activity could be used to prove negligence on the owner's part.

Asking the police to keep skateboarders off the property, is something owners do to protect themselves. It's called due diligence.

As for kicking you out of a park after it closes, due diligence comes into play as well. Parks close for a reason. Bad things can happen there at night. Rather than go around all night determining if everyone's intentions are pure, the easiest way to prevent trouble is to close the park and kick out anyone found there at night. By asking you to leave, they are making their work easier, and protecting you. And it's not just about your personal safety. If they let you stay in the park and someone else is assaulted or mugged there later on, or somebody breaks into a house backing onto the park, you're a suspect. That's a major problem for you, and a major waste of resources for the police, who then have to sort out whether they believe you were actually involved.

I can't excuse the cop's manners, but it could be precisely because they have better things to do than hassle teenagers that they are so grouchy about doing it. These guys see a lot of things that shake their faith in human beings, they deal with a lot of people, and they take a lot of crap. They have to take time out of their busy day to go over to an empty parking lot and ask some kids to leave (something they might personally not even want to do) and they get greeted with "We're not doing anything wrong. Stop picking on us." And the kids are right back at it after they leave. Put yourself in their shoes.
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« Reply #21 on: May 02, 2008, 11:01:36 AM »

They gave us Breathalyzer tests to see if we were legal to drive, we weren't.  We said we'd walk home and they drove away.  We waited five minutes and drove home.  Now those guys were pretty cool. 

In this case, I will say that you were lucky they did not stay around to make sure you would keep your word, and also that you arrived safely at home.  I've been at the site of a few wrecks caused by someone drinking and driving.  Even once was covered with blood from a girl I pulled from a burning car, because she drove after drinking and dozed off.

Cops are people, you will get good ones, and you will get bad ones, and a whole lot down the middle.  When I deal with a uniformed officer, I am polite and give them the same treatment I would to anyone else who is doing their job.  I've run into ones who were definitely abusing their authority, and have dealt with it - sometimes in front of the judge, sometimes by going to the station and speaking with their watch chief.  

If I have broken a law (most likely speeding, but it's been years), and they issue a ticket, then they are doing their job.  Heck, if they just yell at you for what you did wrong, they are doing their job.  I think that we've gotten too much of "no yelling at people, no taking kids to their home to talk to their parents" these days.  I don't mean insulting, I mean balling somebody out for doing something they shouldn't have been doing.

Sometimes police use some individual decision making ability, sometimes the best thing is for them to let a court of law to do that.

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Andrew Borntreger
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« Reply #22 on: May 02, 2008, 11:36:06 AM »

You could have politely refused to produce your ID.
Uh... that makes sense.   Lookingup Okay, as you later pointed out, that's a whole 'nother story...

Skaters do get a bad rap, and I've never understood it.  But hey, the cop MAY have just been doing his J-O-B, and inside, he may not have liked hassling you over skating any better than you like being hassled.
Then why be obscene?  These kids apparently were generalized just like KYGOTC generalized about cops.  These young people are citizens too and warrant, in an empty parking lot, at least marginal courtesy.  I don't care for KYGOTC's commentary, but I can relate to it. 

Some positive things you could do/say:
"Okay, officer, is there a place where we ARE allowed to skate?"
"Can you tell me why I am not allowed to skate here?  Which law/ordinance is it that forbids it?" (watch your tone with this one so it does not come out smart-assey).
Yeh, right.   Lookingup  If a cop is calling you a "f*ckin' kid?"  One thing I learned about any cop experience is that they have the power and you must acquiesce. 

So, you've met >50% of all cops worldwide or have access to some scientifically conducted research to support this?

Look, I'm truly sorry that your experience with cops has been so negative.  But like others earlier in this thread have pointed out, they are laying it on the line every day and they really don't LIKE to answer stupid calls like "hey, there's skaters across the street!"
How do you know?  Have you access to some "scientifically conducted research to support this?"  Maybe this particular cop gets off on the power trip. 

The truth of the matter is that MOST cops are decent, hardworking people just trying to get by (ie, survive, pay the bills, etc) in an extremely stressful job. 
There you go again, doing exactly what you criticize others for: generalizing.  I do agree it can be a stressful, and thankless job

Everything is relative.  Get hooked up and taken to jail for real and you'll probably think "hey, getting told to scram ain't so bad."   Wink

I understand your frustration, but I think the language you have used in this thread is WAY out of proportion to being told to leave somewhere you wanted to be.  Even if the cop said it without much, uh, shall we say, social grace, no real, lasting harm was done.  You don't have a criminal record because of this, and no one got hurt.
Agreed; KYGOTC is obviously angry and apparently has been hassled by cops more than once.  I also wonder if the generation gap doesn't play a part here.  Nonetheless, generalizing cops as "pigs" is not cool.  It's unreasonable. 
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« Reply #23 on: May 02, 2008, 11:38:57 AM »

Just like in all walks of life, you have cops who are "D-bags" and others who aren't and I've dealt with both types.  

I've been pulled over for minor idiotic offenses like going 5 over or California rolling a stop sign. I find these to happen in one horse towns more than anything. sadly, I seem to always live in one horse towns.  Granted I know they're doing their job but I can't count the amount of times a cop car goes flying by me doing excessive speeds.  I've called the cops on loud parties in the neighborhood and they never come.  Even after I stress the fact I have an infant son who is being awoken by the noise.  I've had an off duty cop harass my friend and I while we were fishing because he had a neighbor b*tch to him that we too close to his house.  Mind you we were in a boat about 20 yards off shore.  I filed a complaint on the cop by the way.  I've had friends and relatives who have become complete pricks after getting a badge.  So yeah, some cops are D-bags, sorry.

On the other hand, on the same pond where we were harassed, we had a cop take care of a drunken vargrant who was blocking the boat launch.  In the town I live now, they went the extra mile investigating vandalism to my house and car.  I've had cops pull me over who were nice enough to let me go.  I've been in several accidents and the cops truly made the situation much easier to handle. So yeah, some cops aren't D-bags, sorry.  

Once again, it all depends on who is working where and when.

Quote
Not much I can add that hasn't already been said except that there are reasons why property owners wouldn't want skateboarders hanging around. At the top of the list would be the jump in premiums if their insurance company became aware that unsupervised youngsters were using the property for some activity that could result in personal injury. Not saying it's reasonable, but that's what insurance companies do.

And insurance companies do that because of the second reason - legal liability. Somebody screws around on private property, gets hurt and sues the owner. Or their parents sue the owner. You might not be a litigious person, but enough people are. And even if it isn't an injury related to skateboarding, that activity could be used to prove negligence on the owner's part.

Asking the police to keep skateboarders off the property, is something owners do to protect themselves. It's called due diligence.

Well put Andy C.  We have skaters who hang out at my work place jumping stairs and can't figure out whey they can't skate on our property. 
« Last Edit: May 02, 2008, 11:45:13 AM by The DarkSider » Logged

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« Reply #24 on: May 02, 2008, 02:42:42 PM »


And insurance companies do that because of the second reason - legal liability. Somebody screws around on private property, gets hurt and sues the owner. Or their parents sue the owner. You might not be a litigious person, but enough people are. And even if it isn't an injury related to skateboarding, that activity could be used to prove negligence on the owner's part.


Yea, it sucks that there are people like THAT out there. If I were to hurt myself on someone elses property, i wouldn't sue the owners of the place. It's my own damn fault i got hurt, and thats that. It sucks that a small amount of jerks have to ruin it for the rest of us folks.
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« Reply #25 on: May 02, 2008, 02:50:47 PM »

If I have broken a law (most likely speeding, but it's been years), and they issue a ticket, then they are doing their job.  Heck, if they just yell at you for what you did wrong, they are doing their job.  
Its awesome if there out there doing stuff like giving DESERVED tickets on the road. Heck, i don't wanna be driving around with a buch of dangerous numbskulls on the highway. Thats toatally cool if they do that and bust drugs and weapon dealers and all that good stuff. I'm just saying that they SHOULD go out and do those important things instead of repremand issues that don't hurt anyone.

And I'm not saying all cops are bad. When I wrote the topic of this thread last night, I was pretty steamed. I still am, but now I'm willing to listen to reason. Yes, there are good cops out there. I've met one or two and they do their jobs well. But most of the po-pos that I've met are just trouble.
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« Reply #26 on: May 02, 2008, 08:00:59 PM »

Some things just about the video from a human and professional standpoint. Though Baltimore Harbor is a busy place with large crowds of walking people, both where wrong here in my opinion.

1.) The officer completely over reacted to a skateboard situation.

2.) The teenager did answer back in a whiny voice.

3.) The teenager did respond calling him "dude".

4.) The teenager does know that skateboarding in public places may cause a problem.

When I was a teenager I spent many many hours on a skateboard and rode it often for years, so I'm not against skateboarding. In the 70's we didn't think about people getting hurt, but today it's well known that skateboarding isn't allowed in public and on private property.

My mom was once stuck in the ankles real bad by a stakeboarder. It amazes me how many of skateboarders pretend not to be doing anything wrong when skateboarding in public places. 

Sometimes skateboarders don't understand how someone including themselves could get hurt doing these stunts. Sure it's part of the game to hurt yourself, but it's not ok to hurt others, nor is getting hurt on someone else's property "ok" just because you want to have fun. The officer in the video had recourse to take this kids stakeboard away if he didn't stop. The kid never had the chance to get back on the board to find out.

When the kid showed some marginal disrespect the officer decided to take the board away from him. Perhaps his approach was wrong for this situation. A good officer could of had some patients and taken a little more time explaining things, giving the kid a chance to respond more favorably by reasoning with him. Remember, some kids when they get together in groups have trouble showing respect towards authority. They want to be rebellious and tough, but in a skateboard situation the officer didn't have to go nuts. If they got on their boards again after being told by the officer he could have simply called for some assistance and taken the kid(s) downtown and have his parents pick him up.

This is the second time this same officer was caught on tape over reacting. Where is his supervisor? Does his supervisor approve of this approach? Why is he still employed? Perhaps that is normal behavior of the Baltimore Police Dept. Sometimes bad officers learn these things from their peers. Not sure what the answer is.

Most law enforcement are educated on the use of verbal exchange and force. There are many situations where it is necessary and in fact it is their job to come on very strong in a very verbal way. If that means yelling them down (which can be very effective in some situations) then so be it.

The kid needs to learn a life lesson here, but I can't say a first offense (assuming) is the time to come down on him like this. Being a juvenile unattended in the big city this may of been the right approach. Who's to say what is the right course of action. It's a judgement call by the state, the community, and the police department on how this is best handled.

Sometimes just making things difficult through process is often enough to get people to straighten up, but I've never personally found yelling to help in this type of situation. Doesn't make sense to me. Maybe there is a psychology behind an aggressive approach with skateboarders, but I've never heard of it.

The kid should just accept it for now and not do it again. If this officer is abusive again to a lot of other people then it may be time to speak up. That is just how I would personally handle it.

Some communities approve of this approach and other communities may not approve of this approach.

In this situation both where at fault in my opinion. Everyone should learn to show respect towards one another.

Not knowing the law I'm just giving my opinion. Just thought I'd put my two cent in.  Lookingup
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« Reply #27 on: May 02, 2008, 08:44:29 PM »


Maybe there is a psychology behind an aggressive approach with skateboarders, but I've never heard of it.

Well, law enforcement can and do work as a teams at times with one officer playing "bad cop" and the othe playing "good cop" to get a desired result or info from the different personality types they encounter in law enforcement.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2008, 08:49:06 PM by Conan » Logged

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« Reply #28 on: May 02, 2008, 10:46:07 PM »


Maybe there is a psychology behind an aggressive approach with skateboarders, but I've never heard of it.


Well, law enforcement can and do work as a teams at times with one officer playing "bad cop" and the othe playing "good cop" to get a desired result or info from the different personality types they encounter in law enforcement.

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« Reply #29 on: May 03, 2008, 04:29:58 AM »

Kyle,

There is nothing worse in my opinion than an over generalization.  A run in with a few bad cops does not mean that every single one of them are jerks.

I don't know one person that didn't have some type of run in with the law during their teens.  I for some reason, always had run ins with with the same officer who was always a jerk.  Always accusing me of drinking and driving, careless and reckless, etc.  The guy knew my car and would pull me whenever he felt like, always over petty stuff.  Sure that guy was a jerk but it doesn't mean that all law enforcement are.

I spend over 40 hours a week working with the police now with my current job.  I can honestly say that 99% of the officers/deputies that I work with are extremely kind and respectful.  I've met quite a few of them in person and they are just normal people doing their job. 

As for having your ID ran, that's common practice for any officer.  There are a few reasons:

- Check and see if your license is valid.  It might have a "pick-up" listing at which point the officer would have to take your license.

- Check for warrants.  This is the big one.  I've found that a LOT of people have warrants.  It's amazing just how many people I've seen arrested for a failure to appear warrant and such.

- Provide a history in your area's CAD.  Every time that your ID is ran, it goes into a CAD (Computer Aided Dispatch) program.  It keeps track of when and where you were spoken to and what you were spoken to about.

Cops aren't so bad.  They're just doing their job.  Sure, like anything else, there are some that are burnt-out and are jerks, but that is to be expected.
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