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Badmovies.org Forum  |  Other Topics  |  Off Topic Discussion  |  Weird News Stories  |  12 yr old Grounded for Too Much Internet Use Gets Punishment Overturned in Court « previous next »
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Author Topic: 12 yr old Grounded for Too Much Internet Use Gets Punishment Overturned in Court  (Read 2597 times)
CheezeFlixz
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« on: June 19, 2008, 09:23:31 PM »

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,369044,00.html


I need duct tape my head is going to explode.

This was in Canada ... how long before it happens here?
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ulthar
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« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2008, 09:49:22 PM »

Just the other day on another forum, I got into an almost heated debate with some folks about who gets to raise my children.

Here's what I wrote in response to one guy that was asserting ALL KINDS of government oversight on virtually every aspect of parenting.  His definitions of "abuse" and "neglect" would make most parents, even (gasp) good, protective parents cringe.  The main assertion that he made that I was responding to was that I, as my child's parent, have not to "endanger my children" (though I am omitting a lot of irrelevant hogwash he tacked onto that sentence).

Here is my reply, with the subject line "Most Certainly I Do;"

Quote

When Big Brother (or you, or anyone else that has the nerve to tell me what I can and cannot do with my children) comes and takes my children from me, pays for their upbringing and provides directly for their education, and take ALL responsibility for what happens to them, THEN they can make the other decisions (like to sail or not, or on what boat with whom).

Until then, since I pay the bills and I get blamed if something goes wrong, I get to make the choices.

It's asinine (as in extremely stupid) to expect parents to have all the responsibility with none of the freedom.



Parens Patriae has run amok.  Here's an interesting read on the subject.
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AndyC
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« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2008, 10:00:08 PM »

I just heard about this on the radio. And they say it's not going to open the floodgates to more cases like this. Jeez Louise. Lookingup
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ulthar
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« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2008, 10:24:33 PM »

Hey, Andy, got a question for you.  What grounds does a minor have in Canada (is 12 yo a minor in Canada?) to bring a lawsuit? 
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CheezeFlixz
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« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2008, 10:32:42 PM »

Ulthar, I couldn't agree more, it's SP gone mad or in the words of Charleston Heston "It's a MADHOUSE!"

It's along the lines of kids calling 911 over stupid stuff, I had a niece tell me one time that if I didn't let her do this or that, she'd call 911 and claim abuse. I told her that it would take 911 30 minutes to get to my house ... think about it, if I'm going to jail there will be a reason by the time they get here. Straighten her little sassy ass up, which was why she was with me to begin with.
I think if this happened to me I'd say fine, but nothing says I can't get rid of the computer. I'd tell the little troll of you want a computer, guess you need to get a job ... or are you going to sue for that too?

Andy if it was allowed to happen once the flood gate has been opened, president has been set and that is all the court system needs. At least in the US system. "Them" saying the flood gate isn't going to open is fooling themselves.

edit dyslexic opyt
« Last Edit: June 19, 2008, 10:35:02 PM by CheezeFlixz » Logged

AndyC
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« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2008, 11:27:14 PM »

Andy if it was allowed to happen once the flood gate has been opened, president has been set and that is all the court system needs. At least in the US system. "Them" saying the flood gate isn't going to open is fooling themselves.

Hence the "Jeez Louise" and the rolling-eye smiley.
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CheezeFlixz
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« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2008, 11:30:36 PM »

Andy if it was allowed to happen once the flood gate has been opened, president has been set and that is all the court system needs. At least in the US system. "Them" saying the flood gate isn't going to open is fooling themselves.

Hence the "Jeez Louise" and the rolling-eye smiley.

Well, I never claimed to be fluent in Canadian.  Wink
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Patient7
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« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2008, 12:20:02 AM »

I'm suing everyone who doesn't let me do something!
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AndyC
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« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2008, 06:42:35 AM »

Hey, Andy, got a question for you.  What grounds does a minor have in Canada (is 12 yo a minor in Canada?) to bring a lawsuit? 

Not sure about that, but the radio report said that the guy's ex-wife stuck her nose in there too. He has custody, but the kid went running to Mommy who got the lawyer. This is really something no court should have touched.

Funny, I have a fair bit of respect for judges in general, but every so often one of them goes and does something like this, and it makes me wonder if they wield a little too much power. Deciding whether a parent's punishment is too severe? None of the judge's business, unless it breaks a law. The judge should be giving that kid a lecture about posting tawdry pictures of herself on the internet, and where that can lead. I think the punishment was just right for that. A school trip is not a necessity, and therefore should be fair game for a parent to withhold.
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Newt
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« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2008, 07:04:19 AM »

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/06/19/father-court.html?ref=rss

AHA!  It was in Quebec. 
Their law system is very different.

From this article:
Court has role: lawyer
But the judge's decision was not just a case of a child going the court to get out of trouble, said Miriam Grassby, a Quebec family lawyer who has spoken with the various attorneys involved.

Under Quebec family law, it is not uncommon for a child in a high-conflict situation between two parents to have an attorney appointed to protect his or her best interests, as was the case here, Grassby said.

"In Quebec, no matter who has custody, we have joint parental authority," Grassby told CBC News on Thursday. "There are issues of discipline where both parents have to agree, and if they don't, we will have a place" to resolve the issue in court.

The attorney representing the child had been chosen and agreed to by both parents, she noted.

"The court is there to be an objective third party, and these children who are in these high-conflict situations need the protection of the court," Grassby said.

"I think we could presume the judge had good judgment in the fact that she read the statements and found out what both parents were saying, and that the child was punished at least once for that, and this was excessive punishment."

Edited to add: Since the situation seems to include some considerable friction with the mother ("high conflict situation")...I would not be surprised if the mother was the actual force behind the original court action.  At any rate, it is being appealed.  His lawyer says the father has had his authority undermined. (no duh eh?) Good luck to him. 

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ulthar
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« Reply #10 on: June 20, 2008, 07:54:35 AM »


Under Quebec family law, it is not uncommon for a child in a high-conflict situation between two parents to have an attorney appointed to protect his or her best interests, as was the case here, Grassby said.


That's sort of the problem - that somehow someone believes that a lawyer, or the court, is better able to protect her best interests than HER OWN PARENTS.   Hatred

Quote

"In Quebec, no matter who has custody, we have joint parental authority," Grassby told CBC News on Thursday. "There are issues of discipline where both parents have to agree, and if they don't, we will have a place" to resolve the issue in court.


Now THAT is truly scary.  "we will have a place" to interfere on the basis of both parents not agreeing?  Wow wow wow wow wow.

Quote

"The court is there to be an objective third party, and these children who are in these high-conflict situations need the protection of the court," Grassby said.


Says a person with a stereotypical Lawyer's attitude - "it's MY place to decide" x y or z for someone else.

Quote

"I think we could presume the judge had good judgment in the fact that she read the statements and found out what both parents were saying, and that the child was punished at least once for that, and this was excessive punishment."


Bottom line this is colossally STUPID.  Okay, so Dad does something to PROTECT his child and to teach her important LONG TERM lessons about life, and some idiot judge says just because he's tried to correct her behavior before, to do so again is EXCESSIVE?

And this Lawyer seems to agree with that?

Arrrrgggggh.  Duct Tape Indeed.

Quote

At any rate, it is being appealed. 


It is completely offensive that this even has to be appealed....that the court is even INVOLVED.  We are not talking about a dude beating his kid with a rubber hose or selling her undergarments at an adult book store.  We are talking about not letting teenager (a) post inappropriate pictures of herself on the Internet and (b) not take a school trip.

This whole thing is just over the top insane.
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Professor Hathaway:  I noticed you stopped stuttering.
Bodie:      I've been giving myself shock treatments.
Professor Hathaway: Up the voltage.

--Real Genius
AndyC
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« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2008, 08:08:53 AM »

Long-term is right. Dad is considering the kid's long-term wellbeing, while the court system is reinforcing her adolescent view that this school trip is the be all and end all.

And Mom is obviously using this to stick it to her ex, which the court is only too happy to assist.

As far as I'm concerned, in your custody means subject to your rules. I can see both parents having a say in big things, like surgery or something, but day-to-day discipline should be up to the one she lives with. No abuse, none of anyone else's business. Parents forbid kids from doing things all the time, and for worse reasons than this guy.
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BTM
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« Reply #12 on: June 24, 2008, 10:03:30 AM »

AHA!  It was in Quebec. 

Ahhh... the French part of Canada.  Now it all makes sense. 
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Patient7
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« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2008, 11:24:15 AM »

AHA!  It was in Quebec. 

Ahhh... the French part of Canada.  Now it all makes sense. 


Those crazy French-Canadians.
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Joe the Destroyer
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« Reply #14 on: July 04, 2008, 01:59:24 AM »

She should be lucky it wasn't my parents.  For them, it wasn't "you're grounded," it was "you're murdered." 

Poor ol' Billy...
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