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Author Topic: Republican Scott Brown defeats Coakley in Massachusetts  (Read 8410 times)
Jim H
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« on: January 19, 2010, 11:02:16 PM »

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_MASSACHUSETTS_SENATE?SITE=VTBEN&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT
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In epic upset, GOP's Brown wins Mass. Senate race

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BOSTON (AP) -- In an epic upset in liberal Massachusetts, Republican Scott Brown rode a wave of voter anger to win the U.S. Senate seat held by the late Edward M. Kennedy for nearly half a century, leaving President Barack Obama's health care overhaul in doubt and marring the end of his first year in office.

The loss by the once-favored Democrat Martha Coakley in the Democratic stronghold was a stunning embarrassment for the White House after Obama rushed to Boston on Sunday to try to save the foundering candidate. Her defeat on Tuesday signaled big political problems for the president's party this fall when House, Senate and gubernatorial candidates are on the ballot nationwide.

"I have no interest in sugarcoating what happened in Massachusetts," said Sen. Robert Menendez, the head of the Senate Democrats' campaign committee. "There is a lot of anxiety in the country right now. Americans are understandably impatient."

Brown will become the 41st Republican in the 100-member Senate, which could allow the GOP to block the president's health care legislation and the rest of his agenda. Democrats needed Coakley to win for a 60th vote to thwart Republican filibusters.

The Republican will finish Kennedy's unexpired term, facing re-election in 2012.


Regardless of your views on health care, something has to be done for it.  From what I've seen of the Republicans on this, they have no real idea what to do except to prevent the democracts from doing anything (all the republican ideas are scattered and there's no unity, which makes them utterly useless as anything besides obstacles).  There's not even an attempt to reach a compromise from them on anything.  So, I find it pretty sad that the democrats have lost their filibuster proof majority on this. 

It's equally sad that Kennedy's death leads to the situation, considering what he tried to do with the large majority of his career.  No matter what else you may think of the man, he certainly tried hard for health care reform long before it was such a hot button issue.
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indianasmith
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« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2010, 11:16:42 PM »

As a staunch opponent of socialized medicine, I take the opposite view.  the Democrats brought this on themselves through their arrogance and sense of entitlement, and Brown ran a magnificent campaign.  I have a feeling the Dems are going to get a 1994-style "woodshedding" this fall and I am thrilled at the prospect!

At the same time, if this issue means a lot to you, I can sympathize with what it feels like for the guys you support to get slammed at the polls.  It's happened to me in the last two election cycles.

In summation, you have my sympathy on a personal level, but I think this outcome is best for the country as a whole.  I don't believe socialized medicine is good for America, and the current "health care" bill is the worst of both worlds - it doesn't really extend coverage to that many more Americans, and it will drive many private insurers out of business.
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3mnkids
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« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2010, 12:02:43 AM »

Its unfortunate that he won but the democrats didnt use the gift of a filibuster majority anyway. They cowed down, kissed ass, and played nice when they should have done what the republicans would have.. said eff you! we are passing it.

The republicans dont have a plan, other than too obstruct the process.   In the long run I dont believe this one election matters. Its not like everyone is going to vote republican.. Coakley was a sorry candidate.

Im not a fan of the heath care bill as it stands now but do believe we need something. To many people are dying while insurance companies get rich. enough.
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Jim H
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« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2010, 12:06:48 AM »

The current plan isn't socialized medicine (especially not with the dropped public option), and it isn't fantastic.  But it's still better than nothing.  We're not going to get nothing even with the lost seat, since there are still ways for the democrats to get this passed if they wish.  But, with the way politics are right now, when the two sides are quite close in the senate, it just means we get NOTHING AT ALL, or bills watered down so much they're virtually worthless.  Not to say the democrats would be leaning way over the aisle if they were the minority either.  The republicans now sure aren't, though.

And with the republicans scattered with no clear direction at all, and no real plans for health care, I'd rather the democrats be leading right now.  I don't really know what is the best system, I just know the health care industry is incredibly inefficient and makes ridiculous profits.  I think I like the German idea of forcing them to be non-profit.  Their health care system is great, is far cheaper than ours, and isn't socialized.  

On another note, I keep hearing the republicans complaining the public option would kill off private insurers because...  It'd have a larger pool, and thereby be cheaper.  With or without huge government subsidy.  Shouldn't the democrats be making this argument?




....I think what we need right now is a constitutional amendment banning political parties.  How 'bout it?   TongueOut
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indianasmith
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« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2010, 12:21:37 AM »

they would just re-emerge under another name.  It is the nature of like-minded people to  band together, since the days of Jefferson and Hamilton.
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« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2010, 12:48:29 AM »

Of course one should note that just becuase there are 41 republican seats doesn't mean that all of them are going to vote down the bill, just as all of the 59 democrats might not vote for the bill. Also sometimes senators don't vote! A good example would be the senate motion condeming McCarthy in the 50s the vote was 65-22 that only is 87 votes, which leaves over ten senators unaccounted for (I can't remember how many states there where at this time so there might have been less than 100 senators)!
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Allhallowsday
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« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2010, 01:22:48 AM »

Of course one should note that just becuase there are 41 republican seats doesn't mean that all of them are going to vote down the bill, just as all of the 59 democrats might not vote for the bill. Also sometimes senators don't vote! A good example would be the senate motion condeming McCarthy in the 50s the vote was 65-22 that only is 87 votes, which leaves over ten senators unaccounted for (I can't remember how many states there where at this time so there might have been less than 100 senators)!
There were 48 states at that time, and for a long time prior.
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trekgeezer
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« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2010, 08:45:01 AM »

it just means we get NOTHING AT ALL,



....I think what we need right now is a constitutional amendment banning political parties.  How 'bout it?   TongueOut


I'm with you Jim , you hit the nail on the head.  This is the Democrats fault though.  They should've said to hell with bipartisanship pushed their agenda through.  We're going to have nothing now but the same old bickering.

 
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Skull
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« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2010, 12:38:33 PM »

If the "Health Care" plan is so dam good then whats with the back door deals? Why is it so necessary to push the bill into law and the "Health Care Plan" will not be activated until after 2012, yet people will be paying taxes on the bill as early as this year!

The idea stinks and I'm very happy that the American People told Obama "STOP!"

The point of this election is a stepping stone... American People are not taking this crap any more and most importantly is telling the dems and those working with Obama's Health Care plan, the Global Warming Hoax and the Trillion Dollar Bill that their days are numbered.

Today... Obama is a Lame Duck President!
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« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2010, 01:23:46 PM »

The particular hot button issue of health care aside, I don't think it's healthy for our political system for one party to hold a large legislative majority, epecially when they also control the White House.  Fortunately, things always seem to return to an equilibrium whenever one party gets too much power.
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Skull
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« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2010, 03:41:00 PM »

The particular hot button issue of health care aside, I don't think it's healthy for our political system for one party to hold a large legislative majority, epecially when they also control the White House.  Fortunately, things always seem to return to an equilibrium whenever one party gets too much power.

Health Care wouldnt be such a hot button issue if its about Health Care for the poor, like they keep saying...

But the reality is the proposed plan is not targeted for the poor but its subjected into lumping everybody (black, white, green aliens, etc.) into two categories... Those that work for the government (which gets a better deal with the Health Care package) and those that dont (who would end up getting the general plan). In theory (dirty secret here) is those working for the government would become part of the new election machine and they are likely to keep voting for the party that supports their current lifestyle, while thoes getting the general plan are subjected to restrictions and must pay for the taxes...

after all the government doesnt make any money they just take money from those that do and somebody has to pay for their cherry health care plan.

Is single party control a bad thing? It only becomes a bad when the single party isnt listening to the American People.

The problem with our government is not the parties but the system and we need to fix the following:

Term limits... There is no F'n reason for Ted Kennedy to be a sitting Senator 47 years. Our founding fathers wanted a country that is ruled by the people not by a stinking king and all elected government fractions should be subjected to term limits.

Photo ID's required for voting... Here is a silly question, Why not? If I need a beer I need to show an ID. I'm getting tired of hearing about voter fraud, Acorn, the Dead voters, Micky Mouse, "Vote early and vote often", etc... If a photo ID's were used then maybe Ted Kennedy wouldnt be Senator for 47 years...

No Political Campaign Fundraising is needed... Most of the corruption starts here! Political Campaign Fundraising seems like a payoff at times and although it does cost money to pay for posters and people to knock door to door but it hardly necessry needed to raise thousands/millions of dollars, also I dont see a problem for those running for government can use the campaign as a tax deduction (although I'd wouldnt be surprise if its currently is). I also think the internet is a wounderful tool.

All elected officals should only get a buck a year and no Pension... crap, there are elected government officals that are recieving 2 or more pensions... and I'm not talking about small change either. Also there is no reason for the elected offical to live like a king, unless they had money before they get into office.

Double the criminal sentence if an elected offical was found guilty for a crime. Enough of the fun, games and the Corruption.


:)





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Jim H
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« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2010, 04:56:11 PM »

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100120/ap_on_bi_ge/us_health_care_overhaul

Looking at what Obama is trying to do with the health care bill, it's now going to be almost entirely a waste of time.  Great.  Well, the pre-existing condition bit is good, at least.

The republicans will never make any real effort to improve the situation, as near as I can tell.  The republican plan being "Don't get sick" seems pretty accurate.  Seriously.  Regardless of what you think of socialized medicine or the democratic plans, it's at least an attempt.  The republicans have not done anything even close in any recent timeframe, and none of the occasional ideas tossed out are broadly supported by the party.  So we've got a situation that causes thousands to die annually and millions to declare bankruptcy, and the Republicans have evidently decided this status quo is acceptable.  What am I to make of such people?

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But the reality is the proposed plan is not targeted for the poor but its subjected into lumping everybody (black, white, green aliens, etc.) into two categories... Those that work for the government (which gets a better deal with the Health Care package) and those that dont (who would end up getting the general plan). In theory (dirty secret here) is those working for the government would become part of the new election machine and they are likely to keep voting for the party that supports their current lifestyle, while thoes getting the general plan are subjected to restrictions and must pay for the taxes...


What are you talking about?  Have you actually looked at the bill in question?  I might also add the number of government employees is not significant enough to keep anyone in power - it's less than 1% of the population.  
« Last Edit: January 20, 2010, 05:06:43 PM by Jim H » Logged
akiratubo
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« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2010, 05:06:19 PM »

The particular hot button issue of health care aside, I don't think it's healthy for our political system for one party to hold a large legislative majority, epecially when they also control the White House.  Fortunately, things always seem to return to an equilibrium whenever one party gets too much power.

We need a viable third party for sure.
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« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2010, 05:39:29 PM »

I really don't have much of an opinion on the whole situation.  All I know is that this Health Care Bill or whatever isn't coming for a long time. 
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Skull
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« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2010, 06:00:27 PM »


What are you talking about?  Have you actually looked at the bill in question?  I might also add the number of government employees is not significant enough to keep anyone in power - it's less than 1% of the population.  


hehehe... I guess you dont live in Chicago... There is a reason why its called the Chicago Democratic Machine...


Your also not factoring those that depend on the government, currently we have 10% (maybe more) unemployment and the millions collecting goverment aid becaue they are poor. And lets not forget the back door deals.


Like I said...

If the "Health Care" plan is so dam good then whats with the back door deals? Why is it so necessary to push the bill into law and the "Health Care Plan" will not be activated until after 2012, yet people will be paying taxes on the bill as early as this year!

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