Not recycling in Cleveland? They're gonna FINE ya!

[BTM]

So, they say in Cleveland they're putting forth a plan to set out high tech trash cans that'll have a computer chip inside which can tell how many times they're been put out to the curb.  This is going to be used in the recycling trash cans to monitor how much one separates their recyclables from the rest of the trash.  Oh, and apparently if you don't the can out enough, you can get fined up to a hundred dollars.

I'm really not sure what to say this.  

I have no problem with people who want to recycle (although I've heard convincing arguments that, with the exception of aluminium, it's pretty much a waste of time and resources), but still, if you feel the need to do it, go right ahead.  But forcing people?  Threatening them with fines?  Monitoring the trash habits of ordinary people?  Gee, how far are we going to in the name of what some feel is best for the planet?    

Anyway, this brilliant plan will cost tax payers about $2.5 million in local tax money (BTW, the city of Celveland is broke, so I dunno where they're getting this dough to begin with), but people insist that it'll end up SAVING and even gaining money, because they supposedly make more recycling than they do taking trash to the local dumps (not to mention I'm sure all the fines they'll rack up will be nice and juicy.)

Anyway, if you want to read the article, you can click here http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2010/08/city_of_cleveland_to_use_high-.html
http://www.whiotv.com/money/24513951/detail.html

Here's a wacky though.. why not REWARD people who do recycle?  Wouldn't that be a better way to encourage the activity?  Dunno...

[3mnkids]

I think a fine is a little ridiculous but it sounds like they will only fine those that make a habit of not following the proper procedure.

"Everybody knows the ones who blatantly disregards the law," Keane said. "Those are the people we should hit with a $100 ticket."

Recycling is good for the environment and the city's bottom line, officials said. Cleveland pays $30 a ton to dump garbage in landfills, but earns $26 a ton for recyclables

The upfront cost is excessive but in the long run it sounds like its a good idea. I recycle a lot. We have cut  the amount of our garbage that goes into a landfill by half at least. If the city gives the people the tools to recycle like cans, crates, etc.. I dont see why its such a big deal, but im a tree hugging liberal. 

[lester1/2jr]

you'd think they had bigger fish to fry in cleveland

[Rev. Powell]

you'd think they had bigger fish to fry in cleveland

Like how are the Cavs going to replace LeBron's scoring? 

[meanmachine]

 If this gets passed, I hope someone comes up with an easy way to either fry or reset the chips in some way as to make it useless. The city would have to prove the ship was deliberately destroyed and just didn't fail in order to take action against "owners" who didn't want them anyway. Good luck proving that. Likewise even if you could prove a chip was fried the unwilling "owner" could claim vandals did it while the recycling basket was out waiting for pickup. Again, prove the "owner" did it.

This just sounds like something from a totalitarian future society to me and it needs to be fought. I don't want america turning into england where jolly ol' "big brother"  watches everyone every instant of the day with a wed of surveillance cameras and other devices.

[macabre]

hi
I am from "jolly old England". i am not quite sure what you mean when you say you wish not to be like us, oh sure we have CCTV in action but i am positive you would also have this annoyance.there are argument s for and against recycling,if it is done properly then i am for it,but if it is done as a means to just squeeze more money out of law abiding tax payers then it should be abolished.

macabre

[AndyC]

Sounds like it's just simplifying what they already do. It sounds to me like they already have a recycling bylaw. If it doesn't look like you're separating your garbage, somebody is going to check into it. This just takes the guesswork out. Nobody is handing out fines based on this thing alone. There is still a human inspection.

Enforcing a recycling bylaw is a difficult thing, because of the privacy issues involved in scrutinizing someone's trash. I've sat through discussions of requiring clear garbage bags, but the final consensus was that people throw out a lot of things they don't want their neighbours to see. Adult diapers was probably the best example given. There really is no way to tell if somebody is recycling without violating their privacy or wasting a lot of time on pointless random searches. Recording how often the recycling box goes out seems like the most workable solution I've heard yet.

In theory, I can see where it might save a lot of time looking for violators. In practice, I can see too much going wrong with it, either in the technology itself, or in following up on the leads, not to mention making the charges stick if people start challenging them.

For me, how much I recycle depends almost entirely on how easy or difficult it is to do so. I used to visit a mall in a city where they divided some of the recyclables into wet and dry, to accommodate composting as well. The first time I saw this, I read the instructions, stood there with my tray of food court garbage, which seemed to fit neither category exactly as described, and finally tossed it all in the trash. They dropped the wet/dry thing after a year or two.

Where I am now, they pick up cans and bottles one week, and paper the next. I can never remember which week it is, which means it sometimes all goes in one black bag.

To me, the only way to really ensure that people recycle is to make it easy. Two cans in the house, two piles at the curb, whatever. It's when this goes in one can and that goes in another can and something else needs to be cut up and bundled a certain way and the cans need to be rinsed out and things get put out on different days - that's when people just say "screw it" and toss everything in one bag. That's where I think money spent on enforcing bylaws might be better used to streamline the process. Upgrade city-owned facilities. Start demanding more of contractors when renewal time rolls around. Favour companies that have the facilities to do more of the separating after pickup.

People throw recyclables in the trash because to most of them, garbage is garbage. Even if they fully understand and support recycling, on a more basic level, it's all garbage. People don't want to mess around too much with one kind of garbage when they can just toss the other in a bag and be rid of it. Work more on closing that gap, and more people will recycle.

[Flick James]

I recycle and I am certainly an advocate of recycling. However, my disdain for yet more government intrusion into my home life far outweighs my recycling advocacy. Really. How much more does my life have to be tracked and databased by either the government or a private company providing information to enforce yet another penalty or crime? How many things are left in life that don't violate a law or result in a penalty? How long before we are so stifled by our fear of breaking a law or getting a penalty that we are effectively paralyzed?

Or am I taking it far too seriously?