"The Ninth Gate" and the sixth "Trancers"

[Fearless Freep]

Saw a few movies over the last few nights.

First up was The Ninth Gate, starring Johnny Depp.  Depp plays a book detetive trying to track down the only three copies of a book rumoured to have been written by Satan himself.  Seems a book collector hires him to track two copies down (he has the third and suspects only one of the three is genuine and he wants it...by any means neccessary).  Along the way, Depp starts to realize that their are malovent forces at work, some trying to stop him...some trying to help him.

I found the movie had great atmosphere and was really tense in the buildup.   My biggest complaint was the ath ending didn't make a lot of sense. The movie was fairly long (133 minutes) but even at that,  Depp's character's change at the end came with little development and the ending seemed a bit rushed and a bit of a copout.  

The next viewing was Trancers 6  also reviewed at Cold Fusion Video.  Nathan pretty much nails this one.  The dwindling Full Moon  budget is painfully obvious.  Thinking about this one in comparison to the "Subspecies" series or "The Vampire Journals" or even the original Trancers movies...is pretty painful.  The plot kinda wanders away as the movie goes on.  And  Zette Sullivan just wasn't believable as "Jack Deth in his daughter's body"  Tim Thomerson played 'hard boiled', but with energy and emotion.  Zette comes across with the character as too indifferent and as an actress, too self-concious or self-aware about the role that shows through to the screen

[Dave: Blackeye15]

If George Washington were alive today he'd

1)Be preparing for President when election time comes around

2) Retire.

3) Be clawing at his coffin right now.

-the first rule of fat club-

[Dave: Blackeye15]

There! Now how do YOU like getting a pointless post! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

-the first rule of fat club-

[Fearless Freep]

Some people have no sense of humor :)

The joke about Lincoln was related to Funk E pointing out that since Bruce Lee is dead, Jet Li could probably beat him.  That brought to mind and old joke about Lincoln and 'what would he be doing if he was alive today?'

The remark about 'trancers' vs. 'power rangers' was just to bring up another example were as as a series goes along, the definition of the principles often changes, often in ways that make no sense.

[Gerry]

THE NINTH GATE is a really underrated film IMO...one that grows on you with repeated viewings.  The first time I saw it, I felt pretty much as you did about the ending, but I really like it now that I've seen the film half a dozen times.

[Chadzilla]

Gee, a Trancers movie without Tim Thomerson.  That is like a Dirty Harry...movie without Clint Eastwood (at 73 he still seems capable of playing tough as nails) or a Friday the 13th...movie without Jason, or a Jaws...movie without a Great White shark.  Nonetheless I want to see Trancers 6, because it is what I do with my life.  But still, I'll miss Thomerson - his tongue and cheek tough guy delivery made more than a few unwatchable movies watchable.

[Fearless Freep]

Nonetheless I want to see Trancers 6, because it is what I do with my life.

I'd read Nathan's review earlier so I knew what to expect.  It was mostly as a 'completist' type of thing.  I'd seen the other five, might as well...

Yeah, Thomerson added some class to what would otherwise have been some totally unwatchable movies.    When he can deliver lines like "Next time someone hands you an exploding ham, I'm passing the mustard" and respond to "Violence is not always the answer" with "It's usually agood first guess", you can put up with a lot.

[Johnny Blister]

I didn´t understand jack of"The Ninth Gate".Did anybody?

[Fearless Freep]

I understood much of it.  The only 'internal consistancy' part I didn't get was:








I assume the blonde girl hanging out with Depp was a demon or succubus of some sort, based on how she helped him at the end.  However, since she protected him all around, that's sorta conflict of interest because the other two were actively interested in also using the power of the book.  The best I can guess is that Satan chose Depp for his own reasons over the others, but if that's the case I wish it had been spelled out more clearly

Also the end was rushed.  He finds the missing page that had been replaced with the forgery, and all of a sudden he's walking through the shiny door. That unraveled to quickly, but I also didn't understand it.  OK, maybe it was a door to hell or something, but...that's it?!?  Seemed anticliamctic after the rest of the movie

[Johnny Blister]

The girl was supposed to be a demon,but then turned godd,then bad...

Look,the movies is too damn confusing for my taste,OK?

And Roman Polanski is a nasty child rapist anyway!

[Dave: Blackeye15]

I do have a sense of humor, but sorry about the off-topic posts. I say if you do a off-topic post at least answer what's in the topic later in your response. (O.K. I admit the joke made me laugh a littie *snicker* "Bruce Lee is dead and Jet Li's alive")

-the first rule of fat club-

[Mofo Rising]

I really liked the end of THE NINTH GATE, but found the rest of the movie pretty boring.

*SPOILERS* (sort of)
Well, Depp's character is searching for an occult book, supposedly written by Satan.  This book details a ritual that will give the user all sorts of power (or some sort of demonic awakening).  The problem is that there are a lot of fakes running around.  Only the real book has all of the details needed for the ritual.

What's his name, the guy who gives Depp the job, is looking for the book so he can complete the ritual.  He's behind all the deaths in the film.  So, near the end he finally gets it, but it turns out to be missing part of the ritual as well and he goes up in flames.

Depp now has all the information to complete the ritual.  The girl who was helping him the whole time is either a demon or a guise of Satan.  Depp's character is fairly amoral, so why not do the ritual?  He completes it and at the end he walks through the gate, to whatever power the ritual was supposed to impart.  Hell, maybe it was just a trip to Hell.  Why not?
*END SPOILERS*

For what it's worth, the occult part is fairly well researched.  If you go reading "real" occult books, they all have a sort of internal consistency that is replicated in the film.

Not bad.  I still thought the main section of the film was boring though.

[Johnny Blister]

Well,I didn´t understand s**t of what was going on.

[Fearless Freep]

The problem is that there are a lot of fakes running around. Only the real book has all of the details needed for the ritual.

Not quite, that's what the guy who hired Depp thought, but really, all three books were legit, just that they had different engravings.   To really work the spell, you have to have the engravings signed 'LCF', not the one's signed 'AT'.  Each book had three 'LCF' engravings of the nine, so you needed to have the engravings of all three books to get the nine 'LCF' engravings.  

What I didn't like was when it turned out that the ninth engraving was a forgery and the real engraving just happened to be in Depp's friend's bookshop on top of the bookcase.  I don't mind suprise twists, but I'd like to be able to read backwards and see that the twist followed from something that makes sense. This twist just came from nowhere.  Why was the engraving forged?  and by whom and when?  and how dit the forgery get in to one of the books and the real engraving get into the bookshop?

Depp's character is fairly amoral, so why not do the ritual?

I disagre., Depp had a 'mercenary morality', but even as such, it's quite a jump to go from that sorta non-believing indifference to a willingness to perform a satanical ritual for personal power.  It would've be good if that had been a development as the story went along as Depp grew to believe in the dark powers at work  and to be tempted by them.  I never got the feeling that Depp bought into the mystical aspect of what was going on and had any motivation other than the money, and later, his own survival.  He went too far, too quickly, with little motivation, down that path.

That's why I didn't care for the ending, the sudden twist of the forged engraving with no explanation or consitancy with the earlier events, and the sudden change in Depp's motivation with little to know reason given for his change.  Neither fit well with the rest of the movies slow, but deliberate, unfolding of events from piece to piece that at oncewere consistant with what was known already, but also took things in a new, more ominous direction

[Johnny Blister]

If only the movie made as much sense as your descriptions...