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Badmovies.org Forum  |  Movies  |  Bad Movies  |  Swearing..ig and clever « previous next »
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Author Topic: Swearing..ig and clever  (Read 7435 times)
Dirtcreature
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« Reply #15 on: March 31, 2004, 08:43:14 AM »

Firstly, this little experiment showed more results than I thought would be shown. But it did start to degenerate when instead of debating the issue at hand, people started insulting me.

The topic at hand was swearing in films and the slapdash way it censored. It wasn't about censorship in any other field, be it news coverage, politics, documentaries, or anythings else, as that is not what this site is about, or what I was led to believe. It was about films.

To say that I'm selfish and immature, especially without first finding out all their is to know about me and making a lot of ill-founded assumptions on just this one topic is a bit rash. I find it more juvenile for someone to make themselves feel safe and superior by walking around with a firearm on their person, than someone who uses a cuss word every now and then. I did not say I go around saying nothing but swear words, I merely stated that people swear in real life.

Yes, movies sometimes portray "realism" as "ugly". Mostly because when a film is made that shows what good and self-sacrifice people are capable of e.g. Casablanca, Star Man, It's A Wonderful Life...films like that getted slammed as being schmalzty and sickly sweet. I like those three films, by the way.

To have a go at me for slinging insults when I was the first being insulted, myself being called mentally retarded. I did not start this debate for it to be used as a direct attack upon me. I started it as debate onto why films get hacked up and reshown seen fit by the broadcaster and not the way the maker wanted it to be seen.

Some people who I've told about this would join in, but they won't because they said something about not wanting to waste time on looking at a hate site.

I don't consider this a hate site, but I do find it very worrying that when someone hurls insults and I speak out about it then i must be ion the wrong.

Censorship goes on many levels on a broad spectrum, and as this is a forum about movies, I was talking about movies and not censorship in total. To do so would take up a lot bandwidth and time.

I'm a dad, i have a boy and a girl. As far as entertainment goes, the most violent thing my lad watches is Bob the Builder. As my girl is a little older she's allowed to wath The Powerpuff Girls. I have many friends, all upstanding members of society, and those who know about this debate find it worrying that some people have a problem with swearing to the point of calling people who use the f word mentally backward yet have no problem owning firearms, whether or not in a family environment.

This was not intended to make people blast me in any way. I said "In my opinion, movies should be seen the way they were made." but the response I got was "In my opinion, Dirtcreature has the mental age of a 13 year old." That has nothing to do with the topic of films and censorship.

I hope that this in not a hate site, and rather what I thought it was when I first found it...a site about movies and discussing them and and how we view them.

I'm very sorry for upsetting so many people. I thought this was going to be a topic on film censorship, not on my character. Many would define this as a characteristic of a hate site. Like i said before, I'm sorry for any insults I may have used, but for the person who originally insulted me to expect me to just sit back and take it...that's not a sign of maturity, more a sign that you are willing to let people walk all over you, no matter what insults they use on you.

This debate degenerated when I was called mentally retarded, NOT when I defended myself.
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AndyC
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« Reply #16 on: March 31, 2004, 10:40:44 AM »

Let's just take a look at what you've given us to form our opinions:

"It's telling you you're to stupid to watch films by yourself. It's telling you that you are so backward you need to be supervised by the media should you not be supervised by a care worker."

"The reason they didn't put swear words in older films is because it would have given the sterile populous a heart attack. But as we progress through time, those of us who live in the real world, although we know films are fantasy, at least demand that the language be realistic."

"If people want to censor what we watch, let them go back in time and join hitler so the can be good little controls freaks to their hearts content."

"I'm 29, and believe in creative swearing (a friend from Arizona told me a new way of say you're not keen on something is to say it "Sucks the farts outta dead cats...")."

"I also did not realise that swearing also determines if your are acceptible in a workplace. I thought professionalism was measured by your ability, but it seems from what I've been told you can be completely inept in your duties at work but you will be accepted as competent as long as you refrain from swearing."

"From what it sounds like, some who swore within earshot of you may end up in a similar situation as poor old Edward Norton in Fight Club...with a gun shoved in their mouth!"

Those are just the best examples. Based on everything you've said, the image I formed of you was of a 29-year-old single loser who needs to grow up. It was only in your latest post that you really gave us any evidence to the contrary. The lesson here is that people base their opinions on the information that you give them. It might not be entirely fair, but if you make a bad first impression on people, most of them aren't going to waste their time finding out if you're really a nice guy.

As for the accusations of hate, I suppose they hold as much weight with me as your previous cry of totalitarian oppression. We've given our opinions of what you said, and of your general tone. The first few responses you got were polite enough, but perhaps not what you expected. Disagreement was met with sarcasm and defensiveness. You didn't really seem interested in a dialogue.

If you want to talk about hateful personal attacks, you've taken someone's interest in firearms (which has nothing to do with this thread) and made him out to be a gun-toting menace who can't tolerate any swearing. You might be trying to make a point about jumping to conclusions, but it's really an apples and oranges situation.

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Dirtcreature
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« Reply #17 on: March 31, 2004, 01:22:47 PM »

Not being sarcastic at all...you've got a point. I guess I did fire of a salvo without thinking. I guess I can come off as quite sarcastic. Anyways, just wanted to say sorry to all who got annoyed with what I said. I wasn't actually setting out to bad-mouth anyone, just trying to make a point about how you can jump to wrong conclusions with very little info to go on.

But mostly thank you to you, AndyC. You're what would be known in the UK as a "Sound bloke", rough translation is a good man..

And big apologies all round. Was NOT setting out to label anyone dangerous or whatever...

And to think, this all began with the way Robocop was edited for television on it's first network showing!
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Mr. Hockstatter
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« Reply #18 on: March 31, 2004, 01:36:00 PM »

Hollywood censors any ideas it doesn't agree with out of any movie it makes.  Every "good" character in every movie, TV show and advertisement is in full and complete agreement with all of Hollywood's political beliefs.  It seems as if pounding home some piece of Hollywood ideology is a perfectly adequate replacement for a plot in much of what's on TV.  

After that, who cares about swear words?  It's basically like complaining there isn't enough frosting on the cake when there's no cake in the first place.

Characters should generally use language that's appropriate for the person being protrayed, or inappropriate if it helps to define the character.

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odinn7
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« Reply #19 on: March 31, 2004, 02:19:59 PM »

Anyone remember the old days when something would go on TV and rather than doing a voice over of bad language, they would just blank it out? I'm talking about early 70's or around there. I actually preferred that because these voice overs are so obvious and usually ridiculous as had been pointed out earlier. As far as censoring things...I agree that things should be cut on broadcast stations. But, and here's where it gets tricky, if the movie is just too bad and needs too much cutting, it doesn't belong on regular TV in the first place. I can't recall anything off-hand but I have seen examples of this and it bothers me every time.

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AndyC
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« Reply #20 on: March 31, 2004, 08:33:30 PM »

Hey, no problem. I'm glad you didn't take offense to my last post. A lot of people wouldn't have taken it as friendly advice. I kind of had a feeling you would.

Glad we all understand each other.

This thread did draw one thing to my attention - for a bunch of people who like zombies, monsters and things that blow up, we also seem to be really big on family values and good, wholesome entertainment. I guess I've noticed it before, but this is the first I'd really given it any thought.

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AndyC
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« Reply #21 on: April 01, 2004, 12:06:23 PM »

I agree. There are some situations where they just ought to know better. I've seen movies that relied heavily on adult themes cut to the point where it interferes with the plot. There is a point where broadcasters need to draw the line and say "this movie ain't gonna work."

Ever see Demolition Man on TBS? The censorship does interfere with a couple of running gags in that one. They replace the swearing, but Stallone keeps getting fined for swearing. Makes no sense at all.

Actually, that one went well beyond what I'd call normal, because they also hacked out every reference to Taco Bell (ruining several jokes), and removed all but the tamest violence. The part where Spartan taps a passer-by with the stun wand - cut. Phoenix throws a guy through a display case - cut, but the glass is mysteriously broken in the next shot. I'm all for protecting the kids in the audience, but when you have to mutilate a movie to that degree, better not to show it at all.

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Dirtcreature
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« Reply #22 on: April 01, 2004, 05:44:37 PM »

Yes, i'm a resonable man, but nest time you don' like whad i say, I keeel you! Just funnin'! :o)

Censoring Demolition Man for swearing is a bad idea, as you pointed out, AndyC, due to the running joke about need ing toilet paper.

I remember not having the chance to see Planes Trains And Automobiles at the cinema, but had the opeortunity to watch it on video later. However, when it was shown on TV, they deleted the entire scene with Steve Martins' car rental rant. Yes, swearing for the sake of it can make a film rubbish, but his character had been through a lot, so his outburst was kind of understandable.

I too think they should go back to the good old days of simply blanking out swear out rather than dubbing over them. The voice actors never sound like the actor/actree they're dubbing. I remember watching Aliens, and the bit where Vazquez talks about using nerve gas, the dubbed over the entire line with a voice actor that sounded more like Melanie Griffith that Jenette Goldstein! So if broadcasters want to massacre a film, blank over dub any day.

As for swearing to beef up the plot and script, there is one film that really does suck. Yup, as much as I dislike censoring films as films were made to viewed as is, one film should have been banned due to the way it's even more insulting than your average soap, a film whose every other word is :S**t". So next time your friends tell you your fave films (b-movie or otherwise) like Clash of the Titans, The Swarm, Footloose, or whatever, just say two words to them...

Jaws 3
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JohnL
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« Reply #23 on: April 01, 2004, 06:29:05 PM »

>Ever see Demolition Man on TBS? The censorship does interfere with a couple
>of running gags in that one. They replace the swearing, but Stallone keeps
>getting fined for swearing. Makes no sense at all.
>
>Actually, that one went well beyond what I'd call normal, because they also
>hacked out every reference to Taco Bell (ruining several jokes), and removed
>all but the tamest violence.

Notice also that all references to commercial jingles are gone, as is the scene where Stallone "buys" a rat burger in the underground, although if you look closely in one scene, you can see him holding the beer bottle.

Toward the end, Sanda Bullock is upset over having killed a thug, but they never actually showed that, making that scene pointless.
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