Those who support the current American executive branch, explain it to me.
How do the policies this week benefit America or its allies, or overall world stability?
Well, as an anarchist wall street trader and (more ) Uber driver I'm not really the one to defend it, but ever since outsourcing to China began, America has a giant aching hole in it's center. All we manufacture now are missiles and fentanyl addiction. This feels like a hopeless, last gasp at undoing NAFTA and all that stuff and bringing back the working class.
Of course I hope it works, but ... the other issue being the tariffs themselves which seem to attempt to not only even out the tariff rate but to balance the trade levels themselves which I think is a mistake. Vietnam does not have that much stuff we want and they have no use for Teslas and super high end espresso machines or whatever the f**k we manufacture here. It's fine to buy/ sell more or less from one place.
Just so you know, I did get a complaint about this thread, though I don't think it breaks the rules. Just keep things civil with no name calling or it will be locked.
I am beyond caring about complaints. But I am not calling any names.
How does taxing our own citizens on buying foreign goods increase our own chances of more domestic job production, manufacturing, and so on?
I will ask it this way: what happened the other times in history tariffs were used this way in the United States? What were the economic results? What were the political results?
Quote from: Rev. Powell on April 03, 2025, 05:27:45 PMJust so you know, I did get a complaint about this thread, though I don't think it breaks the rules. Just keep things civil with no name calling or it will be locked.
whatever, Reverend. Somebody has a complaint, they could at least have the balls to write it to me.
It's a mystery to me how a man who can manage to bankrupt 2 casinos- CASINOS!-is any kind of financial wizard. The man's an idiot. :lookingup:
I am a bit concerned how the new tarrifs will impact on South African imports and exports 🤔
I didn't generate this thread to create mudslinging. I am just asking somebody who cares to defend it, to explain the logic and the plan. What is trying to be accomplished here?
For example,
" Trump actually believes that all of these tariffs will ultimately improve American manufacturing and create jobs"
Or perhaps
" Trump is deliberately crashing the stock market to buy low. Or to let somebody else buy low."
^ Anyone who defends Trump will continue to defend Trump, no matter what he does. That's how cults work. They don't care what he does or who he hurts. In his devotees' eyes, he can do no wrong.
He said it himself- he could shoot a man on Main Street, and get away with it. Our country is in serious trouble when a man like that can be elected to the highest office in our land.
I'm trying to engage a higher level of dialogue than that, RC.
Good luck with that.
Quote from: Zapranoth on April 03, 2025, 05:50:17 PMQuote from: Rev. Powell on April 03, 2025, 05:27:45 PMJust so you know, I did get a complaint about this thread, though I don't think it breaks the rules. Just keep things civil with no name calling or it will be locked.
whatever, Reverend. Somebody has a complaint, they could at least have the balls to write it to me.
I don't think anyone has a problem with
you, I believe that's the wrong way to look at it. It's just that a good number of people don't want any political discussions
at all because they always turn into flame wars. Some people may incorrectly think that political posts are against the rules (they aren't, though I suspect if Andrew were still actively monitoring the board he would make a rule against them).
Tariffs aren't right or left or good or bad. Without the tariffs Alexander Hamilton had to protect American industries and fund the government we probably wouldn't be here. Without Smoot Hawley the depression wouldn't have been as bad.
Karl Marx, Paul Ryan, and Hillary Clinton are free traders. Ross Perot, Ralph Nader and Hitler favored protectionist measures.
A better way to think of it is real vs artificial. We subsidize agriculture so we can have stuff grown here. We bailed out Harley Davidson so now the company exists and makes motorcycles. A real free market would mean we bought most of our food from another country and no more harley Davidson.
Toys R Us went the way of the dodo, would anyone mind if they went to the mall and it was still there? Some things are saved others aren't. It's all messed up
A vast majority of economists would say the Smoot-Hawley tariff made things worse and prolonged the Depression.
But I guess there are always contrarians out there.
Thats what I said
It seems to me that tariffs *clearly* can be either good or bad. A recession in the US and much of the world is now projected, by some, to be the more likely than not outcome.
That doesn't seem "neither good nor bad" to me. I'm not an economist, but those who are experts in economy don't use the word "recession" with a positive connotation.
probably why Warren Buffet got out of stocks and is sitting on hundreds of billions of dollars on the sidelines
So you were incorrect, then, in saying tariffs are neither good nor bad?
Dr. Grande always breaks it down clearly:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Ai8deGIbdg
Zapranoth - didn't you just agree with me that they could be good or bad?
Biden's CHIPS act is a good example of an economic policy with a fair amount of tradeoffs.
https://apnews.com/article/biden-chips-semiconductor-manufacturing-6251ea5d44f00f7aca9673fd175c2684
would it be easier to just keep buying them from Taiwan? yes
Does that leave us tied to defending them against China though? also yes
Focus, Lester.
*Right now.*. Tariffs against everyone but Russia. Alienation of our long term trading partners.
Good, or bad?
Okay focus Zapranoth What might be the non nefarious reason we don't have a tariff on Russia? hint: we don't have them on North Korea either
Quote from: Ash on April 05, 2025, 01:46:50 PMDr. Grande always breaks it down clearly:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Ai8deGIbdg
That's pretty straight forward.
Quote from: lester1/2jr on April 05, 2025, 10:29:05 PMOkay focus Zapranoth What might be the non nefarious reason we don't have a tariff on Russia? hint: we don't have them on North Korea either
Trump's tariffs: good or bad?
bad
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Gn9TEVrWQAABTct?format=jpg&name=small)
have you figured out why we don't have any tariffs on Russia?
Quote from: lester1/2jr on April 07, 2025, 03:44:06 PMbad
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Gn9TEVrWQAABTct?format=jpg&name=small)
have you figured out why we don't have any tariffs on Russia?
Because Trump loves his Daddy Putin, maybe . . . or else is afraid of him.
Maybe both.
^ More like his crony. They're both gangsters. In ca-hoots.
I still have faith his butt buddies are going to get voted out of congress, and he'll finally get impeached.
AND imprisoned like the slimy crook he his.
Indiana - He may well think putin is his daddy and be afraid of him ... But That is not why there are no tariffs on russia. Anyone else want to hazard a guess?
hint: I already basically explained why above
No trade deficit with Russia?
Quote from: lester1/2jr on April 07, 2025, 07:40:27 PMIndiana - He may well think putin is his daddy and be afraid of him ... But That is not why there are no tariffs on russia. Anyone else want to hazard a guess?
hint: I already basically explained why above
Sanctions
Quote from: indianasmith on April 08, 2025, 06:12:50 AMNo trade deficit with Russia?
That's what I thought, but there is a trade deficit with Russia of 2.5 billion (at least according to Google). Here's another analysis: https://www.kyivpost.com/analysis/50272
Any explanation of why he didn't put tariffs on Russia is speculative. The official explanation doesn't make a ton of sense: https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/5229844-white-house-donald-trump-tariffs-russia-north-korea/ . They say "sanctions preclude meaningful trade" but we actually have a meaningful trade deficit with them in reality. The conservative National Review doesn't understand it either: https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/under-the-trump-teams-formula-russia-should-have-77-percent-tariffs-but-instead-its-only-35-percent/
Looking for the most positive spin, I think it's reasonable to assume it's because the administration is deep in negotiations with Russia over ending the Ukraine conflict and doesn't want to screw that up. They want to reserve leverage for use later. Worst case scenario is pretty bad.
^ Yet he put tariffs on the Ukraine. Seems pretty one-sided to me.
Personally, I don't think he has a clue to what the fvck he's doing.
I'm sure you've heard of his putting tariffs on the Heard-McDonald Islands, which is barren beyond penguins?
On Aug.16 of 2024, at a press conferance Donald Trump warned that the US would plunge into a 1929-style stock market crash if his Democratic presidential rival Kamala Harris wins in November.
And wonder of wonders- look at us now.
The trade with Russia are various exceptions to the sanctions. So we have some sort of trade with Russia, including a deficit, but we are already massively limiting Russia's economy, at least as it pertains to the US and it's allies.
That said, Trump already threatened countries that buy Russian oil with another tariff if Putin doesn't take the ceasefire deal.
For those who voted for him: are y'all still glad y'all voted for him, or is there regret?
I didn't actually physically vote for him but I'll take it: yes. I thought the stock market would be booming, he would end at least the war in Ukraine if not Gaza, and we'd be reading stuff from the Epstein files, particularly about the "suicide". Instead it's economic disaster and seeing how far we can bend over for Israel. big swing and a miss, as they say
Quote from: lester1/2jr on April 08, 2025, 04:45:04 PMI didn't actually physically vote for him but I'll take it: yes. I thought the stock market would be booming, he would end at least the war in Ukraine if not Gaza, and we'd be reading stuff from the Epstein files, particularly about the "suicide". Instead it's economic disaster and seeing how far we can bend over for Israel. big swing and a miss, as they say
Wow, I am impressed. Takes a big man to admit that. :thumbup:
Quote from: lester1/2jr on April 08, 2025, 04:45:04 PMI didn't actually physically vote for him but I'll take it: yes. I thought the stock market would be booming, he would end at least the war in Ukraine if not Gaza, and we'd be reading stuff from the Epstein files, particularly about the "suicide". Instead it's economic disaster and seeing how far we can bend over for Israel. big swing and a miss, as they say
Virtual karma. Lester.