So what do you think? Double Standard or just more conservative whining? (PT)

[Frank81]

this is awesome

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_9J5cJwkLU

"theres no difference between those welfare queens, wall street, the defense contractors...[it's] the entitlement culture in America"

both sides are already whining about this

She has  a point, however, would she even be on TV if her Mommy wasn't Pelosi?    Bill Maher, anyone boycotting him?

[Frank81]

No, I'm not joking. Most of the political commentary, at least from those that are taking the time to post, tend to lean to the right. It's not quite as black and white as that, as there are also a number of members here who demonstrate less partisan thinking and avoid the liberal/conservative prisms for the most part.

Well, In NYC, I'm a  fascist, when I was in South Carolina I was called a  'liberal', same opinions, different state. Of course, in Tehran, we'd both be dead or in jail.

Excellent point. Yes, I am a capitalist pig if I'm among liberals, but around conservatives I often get labeled a liberal. Either way I win. 

Capitalism can be used by anyone,  just look at Communist  China. BTW, What do we win, my hope is to be left alone.

[lester1/2jr]

would she even be on TV if her Mommy wasn't Pelosi?

kind of makes it more impressive though. She's challenging liberals on this issue and her mother symbolizes that establishment as much as anyone.

[Frank81]

would she even be on TV if her Mommy wasn't Pelosi?

kind of makes it more impressive though. She's challenging liberals on this issue and her mother symbolizes that establishment as much as anyone.

Well, count me as very unimpressed. It's  like Carville and Mary Matalin denoucing each  others 'side' while laughing all the way to the bank. The OWS crowd denouncing the rich and 'racism' while being mostly from rich, 'white' familes  from Long Island and parts  elsewhere is also unimpressive to me.

[tracy]

Nancy Pelosi creeps me out...she should have her own horror movie.

[Frank81]

Nancy Pelosi creeps me out...she should have her own horror movie.

I think what  creeps  me out the most about her is her personality, that  lock jaw smile is hiding bodies.

[Cthulhu]

I don't understand American conservatives.
I do believe Maher has more right to call himself a comedian than Limbaugh.
Also, I believe contraception is everyone's business, and it should be provided for people.

Don't take this as a personal attack, please, but I disagree with most republican politics.
That doesn't mean I necessarily support the democrats.

Then again, I live in a different country.

[Cthulhu]

I will say that this entire brouhaha has completely diverted the debate away from what was a losing topic for this administration: its unprecedented efforts to force religious institutions to either provide or pay for services that violate their fundamental doctrines.  THAT is the topic that should be dominating the airwaves both left and right, not the fact that a man who has made millions by being bombastic and outrageous said something - well, bombastic and outrageous.

Yet in America, some of the tax you pay goes to religious institutions, if I'm not mistaken. Even if you don't agree with it's teachings. Why is that okay?

[Frank81]

I don't understand American conservatives.
I do believe Maher has more right to call himself a comedian than Limbaugh.
Also, I believe contraception is everyone's business, and it should be provided for people.

Don't take this as a personal attack, please, but I disagree with most republican politics.
That doesn't mean I necessarily support the democrats.

Then again, I live in a different country.

Contraception is  everyone's business and should be provided  for people?  Don't take this  personally, but, I disgree with that statement  strongly and want people  to stay out of my business, until and unless, I ask them for help.

[Frank81]

I will say that this entire brouhaha has completely diverted the debate away from what was a losing topic for this administration: its unprecedented efforts to force religious institutions to either provide or pay for services that violate their fundamental doctrines.  THAT is the topic that should be dominating the airwaves both left and right, not the fact that a man who has made millions by being bombastic and outrageous said something - well, bombastic and outrageous.

Yet in America, some of the tax you pay goes to religious institutions, if I'm not mistaken. Even if you don't agree with it's teachings. Why is that okay?

Churches are exempt  from taxes. It all goes  back to founding when many religious  poeple escaped  religious persecution from Europe and other places  later on.

[Cthulhu]

I will say that this entire brouhaha has completely diverted the debate away from what was a losing topic for this administration: its unprecedented efforts to force religious institutions to either provide or pay for services that violate their fundamental doctrines.  THAT is the topic that should be dominating the airwaves both left and right, not the fact that a man who has made millions by being bombastic and outrageous said something - well, bombastic and outrageous.

Yet in America, some of the tax you pay goes to religious institutions, if I'm not mistaken. Even if you don't agree with it's teachings. Why is that okay?

Churches are exempt  from taxes. It all goes  back to founding when many religious  poeple escaped  religious persecution from Europe and other places  later on.

Yes, I know they are exempt.
What I'm saying is that they shouldn't be extempt.

I don't understand American conservatives.
I do believe Maher has more right to call himself a comedian than Limbaugh.
Also, I believe contraception is everyone's business, and it should be provided for people.

Don't take this as a personal attack, please, but I disagree with most republican politics.
That doesn't mean I necessarily support the democrats.

Then again, I live in a different country.

Contraception is  everyone's business and should be provided  for people?  Don't take this  personally, but, I disgree with that statement  strongly and want people  to stay out of my business, until and unless, I ask them for help.

What I meant is, contraception should be available for everybody, at an affordable price.

[lester1/2jr]

indiana

Don't get me wrong, BTW - while I am and remain adamantly opposed to abortion, I have no problem with contraception at all - my wife and I practiced it for years.

was the cost of it included in your health plan?

frank81

It's  like Carville and Mary Matalin denoucing each  others 'side' while laughing all the way to the bank. The OWS crowd denouncing the rich and 'racism' while being mostly from rich, 'white' familes  from Long Island and parts  elsewhere is also unimpressive to me.

I'ts the opposite of that. It's like Carville denouncing his own side rather than his wifes,  or OWS people denouncing the utopian beliefs of some of its members.

[Leah]

So what's with wrong medicare is my question. I mean, health insurance to everybody seems like a good legit reason to keep it, yet republicans want to get rid of it confuses me?

[indianasmith]

Actually, Obama's health plan largely defunds Medicare, while Rep. Paul Ryan's budget plan would save it!
The problem with Medicare is that, if unreformed, it is going to bloat up to such enormous size as the postwar "baby boomers" retire that, together with Social Security, it will by the end of the decade account for almost 100% of the government's tax revenues.  Not one single Democratic proposal makes any effort to address entitlements, other than to keep promising MORE free goodies to the elderly, the poor, and the ignorant so that they will keep voting Democratic.  Meanwhile, the segment of the population that actually PAYS taxes is projected to continue shrinking, and the budget deficit to continue growing.  Basically, as Margaret Thatcher said long ago, the problem with socialism is that eventually, you run out of other people's money.

[Mofo Rising]

Well, it's also why I've pretty much turned it all off...I don't watch news, I don't listen to talk radio much at all (once a month at the very most) and I have no interest in participating in being an audience for it.  The general media is every bit as rabid and offensive as Rush is purported to be.

They are offensive to all of us that happen to disagree with them and how they report the news.

If you deny that, you are not being honest and seeing things from the perspective of others.  (sigh, again, to avoid misunderstandings, that's the rhetorical you).

I turned it all off years ago. The media circus that is mainstream cable news is anathema to me, I don't get the sense that they are even trying for objectivity anymore. I now get my news from a multitude of outlets, and I am always aware of the position the person reporting the news is coming from.

All mass news outlets are sensationalistic. They have to be because news programs are vehicles for selling advertising dollars. Selling papers (or TV time) is profitable because it sells advertising space. That is the model all newspapers follow. The money is not papers sold, it's in advertising space sold. The circulation figures are only a metric for how much the advertisers are willing to spend. In this sense, journalism in this country is fatally flawed.

That's not to say important articles can't be published.

Rush Limbaugh came to prominence in the midst of a communication revolution. The people who were allowed to broadcast in this country used to be so tightly controlled. Two or three networks presenting the news used to be the norm. Limbaugh found a new outlet, AM talk radio, and carved an empire.

Now we have an even broader outlet, the internet, and it's made shows like Rush's less and less relevant.

So now, if you're lucky enough to be a person with access to the internet, you have a broader base of communication that was ever before possible. There is, pardon my French, a metric s**t ton of people who are willing to talk about conservatism from your point of view. Limbaugh becomes less relevant because he comes across as a provocateur using conservative issues as an excuse to remain on the air. He's flailing, a dinosaur doomed to die an ignoble death, which he's pretty much cemented for himself with his clumsy antics.

The less you think of "the media" as a monolithic entity the better. I find it incredibly interesting that everybody seems to be watching the same news sources, and yet those who consider themselves "conservative" find a "liberal" bias, and those who consider themselves "liberal" watch the exact same news sources and find a "conservative" bias.

Whatever. There is a revolution in human communication happening right now. Intelligent conservative thought is no longer solely the province of people like Rush Limbaugh. He's a court jester. There's no reason to go along with him when he spouts hateful rhetoric for ratings, not when there is literally a whole world of intelligent criticism happening. He is now actively harmful to the beliefs he professes to spout for.

This entire thread is a fine example of communication that was not previously possible. We're now arguing directly at a level that would not have been possible 20 years ago. No need for Limbaugh.