Origin of "Five by five"?

[John]

After watching Aliens again tonight, I started wondering about the origin of the phrase "Five by five". I know from the context it's used in that means "ok" as in "Things are ok/five by five." but where does it come from? All my searches on the net have come up with pages related to Aliens, Buffy or stories about Aliens or Buffy.

[Dano]

Isn't that the dimensions of a fighting hole or fox hole?  Five by five feet and you're okay?  Not sure that's right but I seem to remember it from somewhere.

I heard the origin of "bought the farm" the other day.  The families of soldiers who were killed in WWII got $10,000...  often enough to pay off their farm.

[Andrew]

As I understand it, this was the old return to a "Radio Check" call.  5 by 5 meant the same as "Loud and Clear."  Now operators use answers like "Loud and Clear," "Loud and Distorted," or "Weak and Intermittent" (there are more options).

Oh, and you never say "Repeat" if you did not understand the last transmission.  That is the signal for a fire mission to be fired again (mortars, arty, etc.).

Try looking up some of the civilian radio stuff, I bet www.fcc.gove would have info for radio operators.

[Andrew]

Dano wrote:
>
> I heard the origin of "bought the farm" the other day.  The
> families of soldiers who were killed in WWII got $10,000...
> often enough to pay off their farm.

I am not certain that this is correct.  A quick check at www.snopes.com says "Undetermined."  Here it is:

http://www.snopes.com/language/phrases/farm.htm

Snopes is a really good place to start investigating stuff that has been passed to you as "the truth."

[John]

>As I understand it, this was the old return to a "Radio Check" call. 5 by 5 meant
>the same as "Loud and Clear."

Ok, but how did they come up with the phrase itself? Most phrases make sense in the context that they're originally used in, but the 5's don't seem to actually stand for anything, unless they used numbers to rate the volume and clarity of the signal, as in a bad signal might might be 2x2.

[Aviation Glossary]

Five by five is an expression used in aviation (and maybe other)  radio communication to indicate the quality and loudness of received voice  transmissions. Rated one to five indicates - first figure - clearness and -  second - loudness. Five by five means that a transmission is received clear  and loud (in clear words usually loud and clear is used...). One by one, on  the other hand, means it can hardly be heard and is not understandable. If  you have a loud but distorted transmission, you may hear two by five, and a  weak but clearly understandable one may be called five by three... The  definition of this must be included somewhere in a radiotelephony document   of ICAO (International Civil Aviation Organisation)

http://www.aopa.ch/xgloss.htm#QQ

[John]

Thanks for the explanation. Now it makes sense.

[Fearless Freep]

Not really, because I'm not sure that makes any sense for a pilot.  In "Aliens" the pilot of the craft seems to use it as an expression that they're set up for a good approach,  Even if "5 by 5' means "Loud and clear" why would a pilot, on approaching a landing, say 'we're in the pipe, five by five"??

[John]

>In "Aliens" the pilot of the craft seems to use it as an expression that they're set
>up for a good approach, Even if "5 by 5' means "Loud and clear" why would a
>pilot, on approaching a landing, say 'we're in the pipe, five by five"??

Because it got turned into a generic expression for everything being ok, on track, etc. Just think of it was a wordy substitute for "ok".

[Redjack]

In the context of the aliens movie, I'd assume  'In the pipe, 5 by 5'  to mean that the ship was in the correct trajectory for decent into atmosphere.  I agree, the usage is a bit weird, but it would make sense in that context.

I'm no expert on space travel, but from what i understand, a re-entry corridor is a pretty narrow thing to hit properly.