OT: Grave Robbing

[Ash]

Many of you know that my brother was killed last year in a motorcycle accident on July 12th 2003.  The 1 year anniversary of his death is this Monday and I'm not looking forward to it.
The sadness will strike hard again but I'm ready for it.



Well, it seems that we have had a problem with grave robbers.
We buy nice things to put by his grave only to go there a week later to visit him and they're stolen.
We bought a nice expensive set of wooden & metal chimes (they cost about $50.00) attached to a shepherd's hook....STOLEN.
We bought extra shepherd's hooks and hung nice plants from them....STOLEN.
We even put red, white & blue balloons there for the 4th of July.....STOLEN.

In recent months my mother has even gone so far as to buy those tough plastic tie strips (kind of like the ones you see the military handcuffing suspected Iraqi insurgents with on the news) to keep them firmly in place and still the plants were stolen.
Someone actually took the time to cut the tie straps to steal the plants.
In the case of the chimes, they yanked the hook right out of the ground and took everything.

My parents put a thick & heavy hardback diary-type book in a waterproof Ziploc bag where any visitors to my brother's grave can open it, read through previous entries and then write something in it for him.
It included a nice memorial pewter bookmark, his picture and a pen to write in it with.
It was stolen just yesterday.

My family & I went through enough having to cope with his death and then some ignorant, gutless, kleptomaniac piece of s**t steals our chimes, plants, shepherd's hooks and our thoughts & writings in that diary.
Hell, I wrote to my brother just a week ago and now it's gone.



I went into the main office of the cemetery/funeral home and asked them about it.
They simply stated that not all people are playing with a full deck and basically there was nothing they could do about it.
It is an open cemetery 24/7 and lots of people go through there.

I wasn't looking for any kind of compensation from them, just maybe a bit more vigilance in watching out for all the deceased people's graves.
Not just my brother's but all the graves.
If they've stolen from us then it definitely stands to reason that other peoples' loved ones have been stolen from as well.
They admitted that thefts there have been abundant and that they've never caught anyone yet but if they did, they would prosecute to the fullest extent of the law.
They made it clear that they were on my side.

I simply cannot understand the mindset of an individual who would steal from a person's grave.
To me, that is the ULTIMATE in disrespect.
It doesn't get any f**king lower than that.

I would so love to catch the person or persons doing this.
I would attack them right then and there without warning...not caring if I went to jail for assault.
To me, it would be well worth it.
People who steal from my brother's grave deserve to be punished with pain and suffering at my hands in my opinion.
I know, I know.  Violence doesn't solve anything but damn would it feel good to get my hands on them!
I would dish out what they had coming to them...not just for my family but for all the other families they've stolen from also.

What bothers my family & I most of all is that we suspect that it's a woman committing these thefts.
My brother's ex-girlfriend claimed she saw a woman that she did not recognize walking away from his grave as she approached it in her car.
It may be circumstantial but you never know.

What do you think of this?
Can you offer any honest psychological opinions as to why a person would do this?
What would you do if you actually caught someone in the act of stealing from your close loved one's grave?



Post Edited (07-13-04 03:38)

[Neon Noodle]

Who really knows - some people in this world could be jealous of the love and caring that you and our family still give to your brother after his passing.

Some folks might want those items (chimes, diary) to know why you all cared so much about him, and keep those items for themselves in the misguided hope that some of that caring would come their way.

Or maybe there are some folks out there that probably have an easier time stealing from the dead than trying to communicate with the living. Just my thoughts.

[Acidburn]

My Stepfather was an absolute psychopath.  He shot himself  multiple times and me once.  He also had a very bad problem with stealing things, he would take anything he could fit  in his pocket or under his coat.  We spoke to several Dr.'s about this problem and we were told that it is much like a disease, it does not even register that he is doing anything wrong.  
That being said, there are many people out there who just cannot help themselves when they see something the like and they think they can take it.......they do!  
I completely understand how you feel, and being in the same situation if I ever cought the person doing these things, I would beat the hell outta them also.  
On the other hand there is always the possibility that people are taking these things for the sole purpose of selling them.  I do not believe a NORMAL person would do somtething like this.  I spent 3 years in a deep drug induced depression.  I know the things that I would have done (and somet things I did)  to get that next fix.  A user will take anything they think they can get some cash for or trade for drugs.   I know, I have done it.  

Anyways, Ash.  I understand what you are going through.  My girlfriend of 2 years was killed in a car wreck, which is what got me started on drugs.  I am glad to see you taking such a tragic loss better than I did.  You have my  condolences.

[raj]

That's just plain f**king awful.  Some people just have no concept of others, but then they are living in their own hell.

[BeyondTheGrave]

dam ash iam sorry to hear about that. my grandmother has passed away for awhile now and i know if someone did that they would get a swift ass kicking. i really hope you find who doing that.

"I know I know ive been exposed permeant psychoses..
at least the colors are nice"- Aeon Flux

[Fearless Freep]

Hate to sound like a cold-hearted SOB but maybe you should stop leaving stuff of his gravesite?  Is it doing him any good?

[Ash]

.......



Post Edited (07-09-04 20:13)

[Fearless Freep]

So lets say your wife or one of your kids died.
Would you be p**sed if I said something like that?

Not really, I wouldn't put stuff on their graves

[Acidburn]

It is not so much about helping them as it is about helping yourself.  Placing things on a gravesite and visiting a gravesite is a simple and effective way to let yourself know that you will never forget that person.

[Fearless Freep]

I meant it as a serious suggestion.

If i left a bike out every night and someone kept stealing it then..well..it would suck that I lived in a world where I couldn't leave my bike out safely but on the other hand, maybe I should stop doing it since it doesn't seem to be doing me much good.

Similar, if leaving stuff on a gravesite in memorial means it gets stolen, perhaps another way of remebering someone would be more appropriate..or at least less wasteful

[JohnL]

>What would you do if you actually caught someone in the act of stealing from
>your close loved one's grave?

You could always put some more stuff out, and then stake out his grave with a video camera. If there are no wooded areas nearby in which to hide, you could pretend to be visiting someone else's grave some distance away. Maybe you and another person could take turns so you wouldn't be there all day long looking suspicious. If you do catch someone, I would either just get the cemetary staff to detain them, or follow them at a distance and get their license plate number on video. Either way, having video of them stealing from his grave will go a long way toward getting the cops to do something. If it's just one person and they kept the stuff, you might even be able to get it back. If you attack them, you'll be the one in trouble and the person might even be able to sue you. I'm sure you don't want your family to have to go through that.

[Fluffy CatFood]

Thats pretty Awefull ASH. I think you should do what JohnL said and stake out the grave, Lay a trap. The aniversery of his passing is as good a time as any to try and catch whoever is doing it.
              I bet you anything its a bunch of dumbs**t teenagers out drinking. Is there also gravestones being vandelised?

[AndyC]

Fluffy CatFood wrote:
>               I bet you anything its a bunch of dumbs**t
> teenagers out drinking. Is there also gravestones being
> vandelised?

Just what I was thinking. There's a lot of speculation about motives, but chances are it's just some dumb kids doing it for a laugh. A graveyard makes a good hangout, and a nicely decorated grave makes a tempting target for an idiot trying to impress his friends. Same sort of thoughtless kids who would pull the lights off a house at Christmas, but it's a safer target than a house. To me, that's worse than a thief who really wanted the items. People defile graves all the time, for no reason at all, for laughs.

My suggestion, Ash, if the cops and the cemetery staff can't help, is to go to your local paper. In my opinion, you have a newsworthy story: family who lost a son in last year's tragic accident now have a problem with people stealing from his grave. What's more, it represents a much more widespread problem in cemeteries, worthy of public attention. Besides, in the middle of summer, newspapers are often hard up for local stories, and they might be willing to play up your story quite a bit. I generally don't believe in giving attention to pranksters, but if the thief feels people are watching a bit more closely, it might help.

Still, I do think Freep makes a valid point. When I read what was left at the grave, I couldn't help but think that theft or vandalism was inevitable. I wouldn't have left it there myself. It's sad, it's unfair, but it's reality.

By the way, reading that newspaper clipping, I can imagine what the scene must have been like. I've been to quite a few accidents like that one - enough that the sound of a large helicopter makes me uneasy. I've also, consequently, known a few families who have gone through that kind of loss. Hope yours is doing well.



Post Edited (07-10-04 09:15)

[Susan]

Ash - sorry to hear about that. soemtimes people do take stuff from graves and put it on their loved ones. I remember once taking a specific arrangement of flowers i made and later saw it on a nearby grave. I didn't take it back as I had brought another arrangement anyhow. It seems like a retarded thing for someone to do but it would be worse for me to remove it back onto mine. Maybe the person was elderly and didn't have money or thought taking flowers wasn't stealing but sharing grief. Maybe they were just stupid - but regardless of their motives i thought their deceased loved one should keep them. Now if i caught someone stealing i would ask why they were doing it, maybe they don't realize how painful it is to do that. Othertimes i know workers remove items but usually after a certain amount of time (like flowers and such) as it makes the grounds untidy, but that doesn't sound like the case. Most cemetaries around here are not open 24-7 (as i found out once when visiting a friend of mine and got locked in right when it got dark. I had to laugh, i kept thinking it was her last laugh as i was getting a little freaked out) Otherwise i'd say to call your local law enforcement and see if they could get them to pop in a few nights 'after hours' to show presense and deter anyone hanging out..but as it seems yours is open all day and night.

You can either put a note stating please do not take the item and how it's special to you and your family..etc (laminated). or just not put anything there at all. I know it's hard that you can't go somewhere to mourn and remember with nice items but this is a crazy world. If they keep taking the items i wouldn't provide them with any...at least for awhile. Is there a tree nearby? At some cemetaries i've seen people hang chimes way up in the tree branch where nobody could get to it unless they had a ladder.

Actually I think it would be neat if you created your own memorial, perhaps in your parents back yard or something. Plant a beautiful rosebush or tree, have a marker - maybe even a bench, and make it a place to remember with all your personal things. It's not their location that matters so much as their spirit, right? I think that would be a really cool thing to do and something you could see everyday.

Not that this can relate in ANY way to a brother but I did that with my cat, I planted a rosebush, an unusual kind with massive flowerheads (not the typical store roses) in my parents yard where i can visit it.  I surrounded it with white stones from the mountains of arkansas and it really does bring a peace to visit something alive in memory of one who is not. I wish my grandmother had done something like that with my grandpa (who is basically just sitting in an urn on her bedroom shelf) I think doing this for anybody is a really great thing to do because this rememberance place is in your home, private, you can landscape it the way you want and it will always be there. It doesn't mean you don't need to visit his resting place, but a rememberance place is worth considering.

On the other scope of things it's funny how years pass and suddenly it's ok to graverob. Egyptians burial grounds come to mind - not only tha but it's a bit sick that we display their bodies..disregarding their right entirely to rest in peace and have people pay to look at them.

It's probably kids out of school.



Post Edited (07-10-04 10:38)

[maria paula]

susan wrote:
"Actually I think it would be neat if you created your own memorial, perhaps in your parents back yard or something. Plant a beautiful rosebush or tree................."
i think  its a  nice  suggestion, and thats what my mom did a long time ago when her parents died.
 what would i do if i would catch them? for sure not fighting, i have never fight, and i guess i would not be good at it, im sure i would get a big punch  on my face and im not really interested bout it, maybe i would ask them why the hell are they doing that, thats all i would do.
anyway, im really sorry for what happened to your brother.



Post Edited (07-10-04 22:09)