question from my five yr old daughter!

[macabre]

hi
I always look forward to picking my youngest daughter up from school. It gives me time to have a good long chat with her and she always gives me food for thought, so here goes our conversation today,

Crystal: Dad how long do you spend in mums stomach before you are born?
me: Well some children are born premature but on average about nine months!

Crystal: So when you come out are you nine months old?

me: No , you start your birthday on the day you are born!

Crystal: why? you just told me dad, that you are already nine months old when you are born!


OK guys that question got me stumped, I am not going to go into the debate regarding the rights of a foetus, but why not judge the birth of a person when it is conceived and not when it is born, afterall the foetus is alive, you guys can help me out on this one.

[lester1/2jr]

in the past people didn't know exactly how far along a baby was. you knew you were prgnant when you figured it out. you couldn't do like DNA tests or something to determine the exact moment of conception. so the earliest measurable date was the date of birth.

[The Burgomaster]

This could have serious impact on legal ages for drinking, voting, driving, military service, and retirement among other things.

[Skull]

This could have serious impact on legal ages for drinking, voting, driving, military service, and retirement among other things.

lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol lol

I believe a person born in Japan is automaticly 1 year old.  

OK guys that question got me stumped, I am not going to go into the debate regarding the rights of a foetus, but why not judge the birth of a person when it is conceived and not when it is born, afterall the foetus is alive, you guys can help me out on this one.

Sometimes we dont want to know where, when or why our parents conceived us.

Personally, I do believe life starts at the moment of conception; some groups dont want to believe in this because they want to believe they have justification in destroying the foetus and not feel bad about it.

I hate to be the one that say this... Abortion does destroy life and typically most woman that has abortions do feel the remorse about the ordeal. I know my mother had issues because she aborted a foetus after a few weeks after my birth; the doctor told her it was ok since "it hasnt developed" and my dad say he wasnt ready for another baby... but my mother often felt bad about abortion even years later. It was life that she destroyed and she'll always feel bad about it.

Saddly those that are for abortion dont talk about the psylogical ramifications.

[Umaril The Unfeathered]

[Personally, I do believe life starts at the moment of conception; some groups dont want to believe in this because they want to believe they have justification in destroying the foetus and not feel bad about it.

You have every right to speak on the issue, regardless of the femi-nazi groups who see their vaginas as their key to pigeonholing men on reproductive rights issues.  Men are one half of the creation process, and without us, there would be no babies (although I'm sure science will continue to break the laws of nature, so stay tuned.)

I hate to be the one that say this... Abortion does destroy life and typically most woman that has abortions do feel the remorse about the ordeal.

Saddly those that are for abortion dont talk about the psylogical ramifications.

Agreed. And like you, I also believe life begins at conception. However, there are certain instances: rape, birth defects, threats to the mother's life, ect. where abortion is a viable option,  But just to avoid the night before?  NO.  The corner store has all you need to avoid a potential accident.

How about adoption?

Adoption can make life very happy for those unable to have children, and it also saves the life of the child. Why does a child have to die? Wouldn't it make sense to bring some light into someone else's life with a bouncing baby boy or girl?   Just a few thoughts...

[bloodkrishna]

I guess if u agree your daughter
then she will said " yeah, so you will buy me two birthday presents this year daddy?"

btw, lovely and warm little story
I wish I have my own daughter right now T_T

[ulthar]

Aren't children wonderful in their honesty and openness?

We were sitting in Port City Java one with my children having hot chocolate while I enjoyed a Red Eye.  The place was not overly crowded but there were plenty of other customers present, and nearby.

My daughter, 7 at the time, stated (and not quietly):

"So, let me get this straight.  The sperm comes out of the penis and gets to the egg in the woman, right?  How does it get there?"

I vowed to myself long ago that I would answer my children's questions truthfully and as honestly as they are asked.  This is very difficult to put into practice I find.  In any event, we had quite the conversation there in PCJ, with all those people listening.  Oh well.

To answer your daughter's particular question is a wonderful opportunity to introduce her to the great mysteries of life and how it begins.  Some people believe life begins at conception, and others take a different view, perhaps believing that before birth, the fetus is part of the mother and not an independent life (I disagree with this personally, but if my daughter asked about this, I would not shy from telling her things that I disagree with).

That we call it a "birth day," however, is self explanatory.  We celebrate the day that a child truly becomes a separate being.  It may be somewhat arbitrary, but it is easily definable...and a convenient definition.

The most important thing here is that she is talking to you about this stuff...keep that channel open (even if it becomes difficult for YOU sometimes).

[Allhallowsday]

Aren't children wonderful in their honesty and openness?
We were sitting in Port City Java one with my children having hot chocolate while I enjoyed a Red Eye.  The place was not overly crowded but there were plenty of other customers present, and nearby.
My daughter, 7 at the time, stated (and not quietly):
"So, let me get this straight.  The sperm comes out of the penis and gets to the egg in the woman, right?  How does it get there?"
I vowed to myself long ago that I would answer my children's questions truthfully and as honestly as they are asked.  This is very difficult to put into practice I find.  In any event, we had quite the conversation there in PCJ, with all those people listening.  Oh well.
To answer your daughter's particular question is a wonderful opportunity to introduce her to the great mysteries of life and how it begins.  Some people believe life begins at conception, and others take a different view, perhaps believing that before birth, the fetus is part of the mother and not an independent life (I disagree with this personally, but if my daughter asked about this, I would not shy from telling her things that I disagree with).
That we call it a "birth day," however, is self explanatory.  We celebrate the day that a child truly becomes a separate being.  It may be somewhat arbitrary, but it is easily definable...and a convenient definition.
The most important thing here is that she is talking to you about this stuff...keep that channel open (even if it becomes difficult for YOU sometimes).

I wanna hear how you told her the sperm "gets to the egg in the woman".   

[ulthar]

I wanna hear how you told her the sperm "gets to the egg in the woman".   

Do I need to explain it to you, too?

[Skull]

[Personally, I do believe life starts at the moment of conception; some groups dont want to believe in this because they want to believe they have justification in destroying the foetus and not feel bad about it.

You have every right to speak on the issue, regardless of the femi-nazi groups who see their vaginas as their key to pigeonholing men on reproductive rights issues.  Men are one half of the creation process, and without us, there would be no babies (although I'm sure science will continue to break the laws of nature, so stay tuned.)

lol... science cannot manufacture male sperm (or any animal sperm) because the sperm cells are living tissue with dna. Those woman need us.

I hate to be the one that say this... Abortion does destroy life and typically most woman that has abortions do feel the remorse about the ordeal.

Saddly those that are for abortion dont talk about the psylogical ramifications.

Agreed. And like you, I also believe life begins at conception. However, there are certain instances: rape, birth defects, threats to the mother's life, ect. where abortion is a viable option,  But just to avoid the night before?  NO.  The corner store has all you need to avoid a potential accident.

Saddly rape does happen although I believe rape is often used as a smoking gun in abortion issues. It's a tough argement, the woman isnt consenting for the incident therefore she shouldnt be obligated to carried the child of a rapist... On the other hand, it's still life. Typically, the police department/doctor has a rap kit that is used for instant abortion. (I'm not against abortion when it comes to rape)

Birth defects does worrie me... At what range? Missing limbs, physical illness, siamese twins, the wrong color of hair, the wrong sex... silly as the last two may sound I could see somebody saying these are birth defects. It worries me because aborting babies based upon birth defects does devalues life.

threats to the mother's life...  Another smoking gun, although I think this argument is sad and funny... Why? It's sad because it does happen very rarely... It's funny because those bringing up the threats to the mother's life issue are assuming this happens all the time and then assumes the doctor will not do anything about this. Really, this isnt an issue; it's up to the mother and doctor (or doctors) at this point.

How about adoption?

Adoption can make life very happy for those unable to have children, and it also saves the life of the child. Why does a child have to die? Wouldn't it make sense to bring some light into someone else's life with a bouncing baby boy or girl?   Just a few thoughts...

Nothing wrong with adoption although I think (and could be wrong) most adoption clinics are run like prisons. I've also think the process is purposely difficult, especially when it deals with people looking to adopt a baby. I do believe the adoption clinic and procssing needs to be fixxed.

[Flick James]

I knew this thread was going to turn into a pro-life/pro-choice argument. Didn't take long either. Skull, I love ya but you're really trying to get one started, aren't ya? Can I make a humble and ernest request that we DON'T get into a pro-life/pro-choice thread here? I don't believe that was macabre's intention. I could be wrong though.

[Skull]

I knew this thread was going to turn into a pro-life/pro-choice argument. Didn't take long either. Skull, I love ya but you're really trying to get one started, aren't ya? Can I make a humble and ernest request that we DON'T get into a pro-life/pro-choice thread here? I don't believe that was macabre's intention. I could be wrong though.

Sorry... I believe sex is responsibility... and what can happen after sex is Irreversible. (It's not the question of pro-life/pro-choice... )

I think the best way to teach sex to children is dropping food coloring in a glass of water, then tell the kids to return the water to its normal state without changing the volume of water.

[Flick James]

I knew this thread was going to turn into a pro-life/pro-choice argument. Didn't take long either. Skull, I love ya but you're really trying to get one started, aren't ya? Can I make a humble and ernest request that we DON'T get into a pro-life/pro-choice thread here? I don't believe that was macabre's intention. I could be wrong though.

Sorry... I believe sex is responsibility... and what can happen after sex is Irreversible. (It's not the question of pro-life/pro-choice... )

I think the best way to teach sex to children is dropping food coloring in a glass of water, then tell the kids to return the water to its normal state without changing the volume of water.

I'm not begrudging you your beliefs or opinions. I'm just making a request. I'm not going to even hint at my beliefs. I just don't want to see another episode like what happened with us on the drug prohibition thread. The hot buttons on this issue surpass the prohibition one to be sure, not the least of which are the cultural and religious ones. Best left alone in my humble opinion.

[Rev. Powell]

I am not going to go into the debate regarding the rights of a foetus

Macabre included this in his original post.  It was a wise choice. 

[Skull]

I'm not begrudging you your beliefs or opinions.

You either believe in science or magic...

Science... Life starts when the sperm hits the egg.

Magic... after a number of day's, week's or after birth the baby receives a soul.

Those that are for abortion believes in magic.


I've also realized macabre attempt... although his question is about the moment of life.

Unlike othertopics I dont care if you are for abortions but I do want to point out its the destruction of life (no matter how anybody tries to justify the action)