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Badmovies.org Forum  |  Movies  |  Press Releases and Film News  |  Republican Scott Brown defeats Coakley in Massachusetts « previous next »
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Author Topic: Republican Scott Brown defeats Coakley in Massachusetts  (Read 8545 times)
Jim H
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« Reply #15 on: January 20, 2010, 11:18:37 PM »


What are you talking about?  Have you actually looked at the bill in question?  I might also add the number of government employees is not significant enough to keep anyone in power - it's less than 1% of the population.  


hehehe... I guess you dont live in Chicago... There is a reason why its called the Chicago Democratic Machine...


Your also not factoring those that depend on the government, currently we have 10% (maybe more) unemployment and the millions collecting goverment aid becaue they are poor. And lets not forget the back door deals.
Quote

So, people on unemployment/collecting government aid will be able to use government insurance?  That's what you're implying, and I'm pretty sure that's simply wrong.  I also don't follow your logic on the employees, since government health care is ALREADY good, and isn't going away in any case.

Quote
Like I said...

If the "Health Care" plan is so dam good then whats with the back door deals? Why is it so necessary to push the bill into law and the "Health Care Plan" will not be activated until after 2012, yet people will be paying taxes on the bill as early as this year!

Which deals are you referring to?  You should also realize that no matter how great a legislative move is, there's an awful lot of scum in the capitol who will take advantage of it in anyway they can.  There doesn't have to be an overarching conspiracy.
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SPazzo
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« Reply #16 on: January 20, 2010, 11:36:17 PM »

I really don't have much of an opinion on the whole situation.  All I know is that this Health Care Bill or whatever isn't coming for a long time. 

Come to Canada!  We've got it, and we love it.  I think the reason that some people don't want it is because they don't want to have to pay for other people's health care bill, even indirectly.  It's their money, why should it go to other people?  It's just friggin greed.  Lookingup
[/rant]
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indianasmith
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« Reply #17 on: January 20, 2010, 11:57:33 PM »

I don't care for that point of view.  I donate several thousand each year to various missions and charities.  The government takes about a third of what I make in taxes.  This bill will increase that percentage significantly, while limiting my own choices in health care providers and treatments.

I think the ills of private health insurance are relentlessly exaggerated by those who want to see a government takeover of the whole industry.  It's not a perfect system, but it isn't nearly as bad as some make it out to be.
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SPazzo
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« Reply #18 on: January 21, 2010, 12:27:49 AM »

The government takes about a third of what I make in taxes.  This bill will increase that percentage significantly, while limiting my own choices in health care providers and treatments.

Maybe if the government didn't spend so much in defense they wouldn't have to.
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Skull
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« Reply #19 on: January 21, 2010, 01:10:53 AM »


So, people on unemployment/collecting government aid will be able to use government insurance?  That's what you're implying, and I'm pretty sure that's simply wrong.  I also don't follow your logic on the employees, since government health care is ALREADY good, and isn't going away in any case.


Sorry, its really hard to explain within a few lines...

First, the rise of unemployment was the plan into getting the American People into supporting government programs. The sound of Heath Care seems like a good idea when your not able to get a job or your working with a pay cut. Yep, Obama is intentionally causing the high unemployment by saying things like "new taxes are on the way!" this forces people not to hire more workers because they dont know what is going to happen within a few months.

Second, you have a sloth factor... These are the people that Obama/government wants... They Need Government and will vote for those supporting them with free programs.

Third, you are givin the illusion that everybody has the same Health Care Plan (General Health Care Plan ~ category 1) So the Sloths and those stuck at hardtimes will accept the "high demands" on Health Care because the Rich is stuck with the same plan. They will likely vote to keep the system going. (Look at social security everytime a republican runs for office somebody starts shouting "He/She is going to kill social security)

Forth, Special groups (the back room dealings), Government has a better Health Care Plan (category 2) they will do almost anything to keep their cherry plan.




Quote
Which deals are you referring to?


Hmmmmm... do I really need to list them? It the "dealing" they made so they can get the vote...

Quote
You should also realize that no matter how great a legislative move is, there's an awful lot of scum in the capitol who will take advantage of it in anyway they can.

Are you suggesting that the dealings are necessary to move legislation?  Really? I'd wonder what deals were made to push Civil Rights... [If its good legislation then there is no dealing needed, otherwise its junk!]

Quote
There doesn't have to be an overarching conspiracy.

Agree... but the Current Health Care plan sucks because its about everything but "Health Care"

If you ask those rep/sen that voted on the "Health Care Plan" if they read the bill they are likey to say "no!" (We are talking about legislation that effects everybody in the US and they didnt read the bill they are voting on... And if they say they did they are lying, there is no way they can read and check the materials of a few thousand pages printed a day before the voting.)

Talk about conspiracies...

Sure I'm assuming a theory thats the Health Care Plan is a doorway into creating a New Democratic Machine but its the only one that does make sense... I personally dont think Obama wants to tell the American People (for example) we are banning "pop" because the sugar causes people to get fat and they are likely to get diabetes and its a strain on our HEALTH CARE PLAN. [although the power from the Health care plan can give the government the authority to tell people how to live based on the cost]

« Last Edit: January 21, 2010, 07:08:53 AM by Skull » Logged

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Skull
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« Reply #20 on: January 21, 2010, 01:18:06 AM »

The government takes about a third of what I make in taxes.  This bill will increase that percentage significantly, while limiting my own choices in health care providers and treatments.

Maybe if the government didn't spend so much in defense they wouldn't have to.

Defense is necessary... If there is no America then there is no FREE WORLD. Its that simple.

Maybe if the government can stop acting like children in a candy store...
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Pennywise
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« Reply #21 on: January 21, 2010, 02:29:22 AM »

It would have been a more meaningful victory if a third party candidate had run and won. I don't see how electing a Republican would solve any problems after watching the stuff Republicans have been doing over the last nine years. Revenge is petty and never really pays off in the long run, expecially in an election.
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Allhallowsday
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« Reply #22 on: January 22, 2010, 11:00:37 PM »

I don't care for that point of view.  I donate several thousand each year to various missions and charities.  The government takes about a third of what I make in taxes.  This bill will increase that percentage significantly, while limiting my own choices in health care providers and treatments.

I think the ills of private health insurance are relentlessly exaggerated by those who want to see a government takeover of the whole industry.  It's not a perfect system, but it isn't nearly as bad as some make it out to be.
Have you ever been ill?  Have you ever had to use your insurance?  Does your employer pay all or a portion of your health insurance?  If not, do you pay for your own family policy?  How many individuals in your family are being covered by your policy?  Are both you and your spouse working?  And if so, earning insurance coverage?  How would your choices for health care providers and/or treatments be effected by the Health Care Bill? 
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Skull
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« Reply #23 on: January 23, 2010, 09:22:56 AM »

I don't care for that point of view.  I donate several thousand each year to various missions and charities.  The government takes about a third of what I make in taxes.  This bill will increase that percentage significantly, while limiting my own choices in health care providers and treatments.

I think the ills of private health insurance are relentlessly exaggerated by those who want to see a government takeover of the whole industry.  It's not a perfect system, but it isn't nearly as bad as some make it out to be.
Have you ever been ill?  Have you ever had to use your insurance?  Does your employer pay all or a portion of your health insurance?  If not, do you pay for your own family policy?  How many individuals in your family are being covered by your policy?  Are both you and your spouse working?  And if so, earning insurance coverage?  How would your choices for health care providers and/or treatments be effected by the Health Care Bill? 

The fear is the supply vs the demand...

1st... Government doesnt make any money they take money from TAXES. If People are not working then where does Government get their taxes?

2nd... when government sets up a program they interlock it with several other programs to make it work and when they end the program the interlocking system is still active.

Example story (typical and true)

Once upon a time the government had a vast scrap yard in the middle of a
desert.  Congress said, "Someone may steal from it at night."  So they
created a night watchman position and hired a person at $18,000.00 a year
for the job.

Then Congress said, "How does the watchman do his job without instruction?"
So they created a planning department and hired two people, one person to
write the instructions for $22,000.00, and one person to do time studies for
an additional $22,000.00 per year.

Then Congress said, "How will we know the night watchman is doing  the tasks
correctly?" So they created a Quality Control department and hired two
people. One to do the studies for $31,000.00 and one to write the reports
for an additional $31,000.00 per year.

Then Congress said, "How are these people going to get paid?"
So they created the following positions, a time keeper for  $35,000.00
annual salary, and a payroll officer for an additional $35,000.00, then
hired two people.

Then Congress said, "Who will be accountable for all of these  people?"  So
they created an administrative section and hired three people, an
Administrative Officer at $155,000.00 per year, Assistant Administrative
Officer $125,000.00, and a Legal Secretary for an additional $100,000.00 per
year.

Then Congress said, "We have had this operating for one year with a budget
cost of $574,000.00 and we are $18,000 over budget. We must cutback overall
cost."

So they laid off the night watchman.

3rd... Government makes no money so they never worrie about profit so how can other non-government health care providers compete? Also, the Government can issue stiff fines like Jail Time for non-payment (Its in the Bill) vs non-government health care providers would be shafted if the bill isnt paid.

4th... Some doctors are still waiting for their medicare payments sometimes it takes 6 months, sometimes a year and sometimes longer... Why? Because government cannot afford the payments currently. So what makes you think that government controlled health care will work when they cannot afford the other government controlled systems.

5th... Obama thinks doctors will cut a persons leg for the money... Really? Oh, really??? I tosses this in because the current president is talking out of his ass!

6th... Obama said... If your old and you need bypass surgery I say you should take the pill... Oh, we elected a KING... Let them eat cake. Who the F*** is Obama.

This is why nobody wants the Health Care Plan!
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Allhallowsday
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« Reply #24 on: January 23, 2010, 01:22:03 PM »

I don't care for that point of view.  I donate several thousand each year to various missions and charities.  The government takes about a third of what I make in taxes.  This bill will increase that percentage significantly, while limiting my own choices in health care providers and treatments.  
I think the ills of private health insurance are relentlessly exaggerated by those who want to see a government takeover of the whole industry.  It's not a perfect system, but it isn't nearly as bad as some make it out to be.
Have you ever been ill?  Have you ever had to use your insurance?  Does your employer pay all or a portion of your health insurance?  If not, do you pay for your own family policy?  How many individuals in your family are being covered by your policy?  Are both you and your spouse working?  And if so, earning insurance coverage?  How would your choices for health care providers and/or treatments be effected by the Health Care Bill?  
The fear is the supply vs the demand...
1st... Government doesnt make any money they take money from TAXES. If People are not working then where does Government get their taxes?  2nd... when government sets up a program they interlock it with several other programs to make it work and when they end the program the interlocking system is still active.  Example story (typical and true)  Once upon a time the government had a vast scrap yard in the middle of a desert.  Congress said, "Someone may steal from it at night."  So they created a night watchman position and hired a person at $18,000.00 a year for the job.  Then Congress said, "How does the watchman do his job without instruction?"  So they created a planning department and hired two people, one person to write the instructions for $22,000.00, and one person to do time studies for an additional $22,000.00 per year.  Then Congress said, "How will we know the night watchman is doing  the tasks correctly?" So they created a Quality Control department and hired two people. One to do the studies for $31,000.00 and one to write the reports for an additional $31,000.00 per year.  Then Congress said, "How are these people going to get paid?" So they created the following positions, a time keeper for  $35,000.00 annual salary, and a payroll officer for an additional $35,000.00, then hired two people.  Then Congress said, "Who will be accountable for all of these  people?"  So they created an administrative section and hired three people, an Administrative Officer at $155,000.00 per year, Assistant Administrative Officer $125,000.00, and a Legal Secretary for an additional $100,000.00 per year.  Then Congress said, "We have had this operating for one year with a budget cost of $574,000.00 and we are $18,000 over budget. We must cutback overall cost."  So they laid off the night watchman.  3rd... Government makes no money so they never worrie about profit so how can other non-government health care providers compete? Also, the Government can issue stiff fines like Jail Time for non-payment (Its in the Bill) vs non-government health care providers would be shafted if the bill isnt paid.  4th... Some doctors are still waiting for their medicare payments sometimes it takes 6 months, sometimes a year and sometimes longer... Why? Because government cannot afford the payments currently. So what makes you think that government controlled health care will work when they cannot afford the other government controlled systems.  5th... Obama thinks doctors will cut a persons leg for the money... Really? Oh, really??? I tosses this in because the current president is talking out of his ass!  6th... Obama said... If your old and you need bypass surgery I say you should take the pill... Oh, we elected a KING... Let them eat cake. Who the F*** is Obama.  This is why nobody wants the Health Care Plan!
This long winded and factual tirade seems to have the semblance of a response to me, but my questions weren't directed at you, Skull.  
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Skull
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« Reply #25 on: January 23, 2010, 01:53:34 PM »

Quote
This long winded and factual tirade seems to have the semblance of a response to me, but my questions weren't directed at you, Skull.

Not really long winded... my answer directed to you is:

The fear is the supply vs the demand...

The rest is directed to those that still dont get it :)
« Last Edit: January 23, 2010, 03:01:54 PM by Skull » Logged

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wickednick
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« Reply #26 on: January 23, 2010, 04:39:30 PM »

Im not for socialized medicine I think there are plenty of government run health programs to do the job, I do like the pre-exesting conditions part of the bill. But really what the republicans are doing is the same thing the democrats did when Bush wanted to reform Social Security, they stonewalled it for as long as they could with out offering a better alternative. If the republicans hate this bill so much why don't they come up with a better plan.
I consider my self a republican but the way these two parties work I really don't want to be a part of either one.
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Jim H
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« Reply #27 on: January 24, 2010, 04:02:32 PM »

Quote
Example story (typical and true)]Example story (typical and true)

Source?  Sounds an awful lot like the false story about the Astronaut pen.

Skull, I might add you're pretty much putting yourself in line with 9/11 Truthers with some of your mass conspiracy theory statements.  Maybe that doesn't bother you, but it would me.

Quote
Also, the Government can issue stiff fines like Jail Time for non-payment

Yeah, for not paying taxes.  They can already do that if you avoid taxes.  Remember Al Capone's 11 years?
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Pennywise
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« Reply #28 on: January 24, 2010, 05:45:28 PM »

So has this Scott Brown guy proven in the past that he's got any kind of leadership skill?
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indianasmith
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« Reply #29 on: January 24, 2010, 05:59:06 PM »

AHD - in answer to your question -
While I have never been seriously ill beyond the occasional bout with the flu, both my children have struggled with various health problems, including one daughter with chronic headaches.  We have excellent coverage through my wife's job (Blue Cross Blue Shield) which her employer pays half of and we the other half.  We more than get back what we put into the premiums in prescription meds alone each year.  However, about three years ago we were withoug coverage for several months while my wife changed jobs and sure enough, Rachel had to have a CAT scan.  We had to scrape a bit, but I paid cash for it.

My specific fear is that having a government insurance program whose premiums will be taken out of our tax dollars, and whose costs will never be allowed to increase signficantly, will drive private insurers out of business, and I will have trade the excellent coverage we have now for a federal bureaucracy with the efficiency of the Post Office and the compassion of the IRS.
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"Carpe diem!" - Seize the day!  "Carpe per diem!" - Seize the daily living allowance! "Carpe carp!" - Seize the fish!
"Carpe Ngo Diem!" - Seize the South Vietnamese Dictator!
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